Double Haul timing

[bartdezwaan]

I am posting the question in this category, because the question popped up when training with one of the Dutch casting team members.
We were having a look at his max carry and I suggested he should haul later.
I already suggested this to him years ago. In the mean time he had been getting lessons from certified casting instructors as a preperation for an EFFA exam.
Today he told me that one of the instructors said that it is noncense to haul as late as possible, because it does not load the rod proparly. I am very suprised by such a statement.
If someone asks me when to haul, I always say “as late as possible”. I know there is more to it, but I like to keep it simple at first.
Since such questions for sure will pop up regurarly I would like to know what you guys will say, when asked when to haul.
I would like to give my team members the best advice possible, so I am planning to post al their questions over here

Cheers,
Bart

[bartdezwaan]

Ps. My explanation was that you want the highest line speed late in the stroke. Somewhere around the stop.

[Paul Arden]

My haul is much quicker than my casting stroke. If it starts at the same time it finishes first and the loop tails. Hauling isn’t about rod loading - mostly it occurs as the rod is unloading and its real benefit is direct additional line speed. I aim to haul explosively after the rod butt passes the perpendicular, or sometimes later. But it’s easy to test - just use a tape measure and experiment!

Cheers, Paul

[bartdezwaan]

Paul.
You see someone casting for distance, trying his maximum carry. He starts his haul at the same time as when his arm start moving. The haul is in sync with the arm.
What do you tell him?

Cheers,
Bart

[James9118]

Tell him that the fastest part of the haul should coincide with the fastest tip speed (i.e. late in the stroke)

[bartdezwaan]

Thanks James. That’s what I said

Cheers,
Bart

[Merlin]

But max tip speed depends on the haul timing too...
There was a specific thread dealing in details with this issue, I do not know if it was in the old Board.

Merlin

[James9118]

Merlin,

Bart is asking about a real person casting, not a theoretical machine. None of us can make milli-second type adjustments, we're just thinking late and fast

[Merlin]

I know, James, and I am curious to understand how can someone synchronize max haul speed with something close (but before) RSP, and after MCL.

Merlin

[James9118]

As before, you aim for late and fast and then watch your #5 fly out to over 120ft, over 130ft if you're Bart