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First think I would ask is to get him to fully straighten his hauling arm. Why is he delivering backwards? Some do by the way. I don’t see wind so is it wrist strength? Nice loops. Like John I would have him throw a targets too. This will force him to straighten up and make his loops vertical. A far better caster than I was at that age I can tell you
You certainly won’t bore me with your teaching John. I love reading your posts and your truly great insight into teaching flycasting. It’s also a learning curve for me too. So it’s always an education. In fact I might actually get more out of it than Seb
What I find thoroughly interesting by the way is how similarly we see. Same eye, same structure. I think that’s probably our competition backgrounds.
John, thanks a lot for your reply, I feel quite honoured to receive such interest to my inquiries. Your analysis, corrections and teaching suggestions are world class, and I will try to follow them as much as my capacity allou.
Santiago is a teenager, he loves fishing but not to receive orders, especially from his father so with him I have a double challenge.
The video was filmed the first time the quarantine allowed us to go out, Santi finished his casting lessons with the rest of students (I am president and instructor of our local fly fishing associaton, ARPEMO and we offer an introductory course each year) in September 2019, then we started to go fishing in my area (I have golden dorados 30 minute from home); in January we went south to fish for trout in our hollydays, and from that time he didn´t grab a rod untl the day of the video. Fortunately now he is enthusiamed with casting distance, now that I bought a measuring tape so I think i'll start with distance technique following his interest.
As for the casting plane,not being vertical is a common vice we have in our area, where I live we fish for small and medium golden dorados (average 1,5-2 kg) with some bigger surprises once in a while, up to 8 kg; for bigger ones I travel twice a year north to Corrientes province. Here in Rosario I use 5 and 6 rods, tropical bass tipe tapers, and big heavy and nasty streamers, 10 to 15 cm, tied in 3/0 hooks with medium lead dumbell eyes; for the bigger ones in corrientes, #8 or 9 rod and 6/0,7/0 hooks, 20+ cm streamers with XL dumbell lead eyes, so when casting we unconciously try to cast the fly as far as possible from our head and the tip of the rod, hence the tendency to side cast rather than vertical.
However for learning , as you suggest I will try to corrrect that tendency in Santiago and me.
Paul, the backhand delivery was because I was teaching him to cast in crosswind, I showed him once then I asked him to do it, that video is his first attempt. I think that his fluidness and effortless cast took me at least 5 years to get, he has a much better base level than me to improve, hope he keeps interested, he will become a much better caster than me.
Again thanks both for taking your time and knowledge to help me.
Cheers,
Sebastian
I can understand your reluctance to throw big heavy flies over the rod tip! There certainly becomes a point when they become unstable. James had an interesting Front Page on this recently. There are other ways to deal with the problem such as opening up the loops with the 170/stopless, or changing the plane as in the "Belgian" Cast.
What I would recommend is to be able to cast in all planes, and to be able to change between planes between strokes, This will make you a more-rounded caster. Distance and Accuracy disciplines are both best approached with a vertical loop. There are casting drills which are essentially casting plane drills. My default practise style is vertical and then I use change of plane drills to give me the flexibility to cope with different conditions/tackle considerations. I think that's important because it far more difficult to cast straight than it is to cast off-plane and learning to cast straight will I think improve off-plane casting.
Sounds like you have some really great fishing there! I have a good friend who has been over there for the Golden Dorado. He had a great trip! I'll get over there in a few years. We will definitely have to meet up for an adventure!
Hi Paul, certainly there are ways to throw big heavy flies, in my opinion the best is contant tension casts like the belgian cast, which also has a great advantage: it avoids the dangle they provoque, as in the back cast the fly is travelling below the line; the problem is when you fish from the boat you are right handed and standed at the bow, you probaby will catch the guide's eye before any fish. Other very effective way is to use passive rotation throughout all the casting stroke instead of drag and active rotation, that way the loop is opened and you use the butt instead of the tip.
When you decid to come to Argentina for GD, call me first, it is a cichlotimic fish and very sensible to nature's variations, we have good seasosn, excellent seasons and catastrofic seasons depending on flood variations, rain, temperature, etc. Luckily, as it is a big country we have several different destinations and depending upon conditions, one is preferable than others. Of course if possible it will be an honour to meet up for a fishig day.
Cheers,
Sebastian
I fully endorse Paul's comments on casting plane and direction. This is a great site, I enjoy reading all the comments and watching all the videos, posted from the myriad of people who contribute to casting knowledge, irrespective of whichever aspect of casting is their passion.
Hi guys, her is me casting again, after practising back cast avfew times, tracking seemed fine as the line fell parallel to the measuring tape several times, best shot yesterday was 32,5 mt with a slight tailwind.
Also, I checked tehe med weight, it is 288 grains at 20,9 mt, the whole torpedo, is it right? https://photos.app.goo.gl/XcJGw3CGzxXn1sa76
1. Starting your backcast haul further back in your stroke,
2. Not twisting your rod clockwise on your back stroke (turning your reel outward),
3. Increasing the trajectory of your forward stroke
4. Square your hips to the delivery cast. If your draw a line through your hips it points to the multi-story brown building in the background.
5. Don’t let your reel slide inside your forearm
Thanks John, always so helpful and clear! Point 1, clear as water;
Point 2, twisting the rod affects tracking, force transmision or both?
Referring to point 3, I think the only way I can do it is changing the grip to delay the rotation even more, as Paul explains in his masterclass, also as i've seen in 2016 wc, a swedish competitor adds a full step, shifting from right foot back/right foot forward, also Lee Cummings in the delivery makes a full step forward.
point 4, by squaring hips I add body translation?.
Also, I weighted my MED (I have the green one, at least 10 years old, I had it in the shelves for a long time) and it has 132 grains in the firt 9 mt, tehe total head (20,9 mt) 288 grains.
In respect of point 2, twisting the rod can impact tracking but the much more important impact is the negative effect on power or force applied to the rod. Your video shows the twist is sourced to your wrist and your forearm which means the backward movement loses the stability offered that force by the forearm. The wrist is the weakest joint in the movement chain, so it should not be triggered until the other body joints and levers have been actioned. It is only then that the wrist actually adds to the hand speed which has been progressively generated by the rest of the body. When you action the wrist early you lose two critical aspects of force application, namely the progressive increase in hand speed afforded by the movement chain and the stability afforded that force application. Both result in loss of hand speed. Your video shows your forearm and thus your wrist, twists or rotates outwards or clockwise during your backcast. Imagine you had placed a texta ink mark in the middle of the inside of your forearm halfway between your wrist and elbow. During the backcast the orientation of that texta mark does not alter I.e. it would always move in the plane of the vertical loop during both the forward and back casts. In your video, that texta mark would point to the road during your backcast. That means you are twisting your forearm and that is an error of technique. I have not spoken about the rod because that is an outcome not a driver to casting. Focus on the correct body movement and the rod movement will be optimised. If you focus on the rod movement, bend, load, colour etc etc etc, you will not reach your casting potential. Think of your rod tip and your elbow being in a straight line throughout the majority of the backcast. The rod tip only moves off that line i.e. a straight line along your forearm, close to the end of your backcast when your wrist snaps backwards, off that straight line from your elbow, but still in the same plane as the forearm, without any forearm twist.
I have said before that probably is detrimental to any chance I have of getting a rod sponsorship :-( but body movement is the essence of casting, both accuracy and distance, not the gear you use.
In respect of point 3, the grip is important but the driver to trajectory is the path the elbow follows. The elbow drives the hand, hence line trajectory. Focus on the elbow. It follows a triangle throughout the total cast, back and forward. Each side of the triangle must be a straight line. Now, I know that great Greek caster Pythagorus, would say that is obvious, but I think it is important to state. If you do that you can throw your backcast up and your forward cast up, without any loop issues. The beneficial outcome is the both trajectory achieved and the speed generated.
The step technique is common amongst light line casters and is a key difference between arm and body centric casting techniques. The key with the step is what leg is used and how it impacts the hip movement. Stepping with the right leg (assuming a right handed caster) creates linear movement, and may facilitate rotational movement. Its greatest benefit is that it can close off, or block the right hip movement. That benefit is increased if the left hip movement is blocked as well by locking the left knee. Stepping with the left leg may facilitate better rotation, however I would recommend that as you are starting distance casting, step with your right leg. That will square your hips up to the cast and provide a fuller speed transmission from your torso through to your hand. At a later stage, change to a left foot step and only have the right leg move forward as a follow through of the hip movement. My reference to the line through your hips at release is the best indicator of body rotation, not translation, but irrespective, needs to be squared up at line release point.
I understand that the green MED has a shorter profile before the level running line, than that of the orange MED. Don't worry about that at the moment, focus on body movement and maximum carry, with control, using your current line, both of which will increase your casting distances. Then, think about things like, rods, lines and leaders.
Again, well done with your casting. I apologise for any confusion that may result from my attempts to describe my views about casting technique for distance. I need to put together a more expansive and illustratively supported explanation. At 70, the fly lands too close to my feet these days, but it does keep me out of mischief. Well sometimes anyway.
I should have added a suggestion to change your grip Sebastian. I cannot see it clearly but I think you are using a thumb on top grip in your video. A much better grip for distance is to use the knuckle of your index finger on top of the rod. That will not only allow much more wrist movement but will also better equip you to stop any forearm, wrist and therefore rod twist within your stroke.
