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Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
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Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
If it's going to be measured I'll have to tune up first. I don't want Lasse's speeds to be higher than mine
I wonder if it's possible to llnk the video and the graphs together? I have a hard time visualising graphs and I know I'm not alone.
I don't have the skills to do that but someone here might?
What are you guys working on at the moment? Anything exciting?
Cheers, Paul
I wonder if it's possible to llnk the video and the graphs together? I have a hard time visualising graphs and I know I'm not alone.
I don't have the skills to do that but someone here might?
What are you guys working on at the moment? Anything exciting?
Cheers, Paul
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
I think Gordy made such a link, the video versus the analysis.
I suggest to drop a mail to him.
Merlin
I suggest to drop a mail to him.
Merlin
Fly rods are like women, they won't play if they're maltreated
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
A comparison of the components of line energy between a modern graphite tip action rod and a "parabolic" cane rod, without haul (fishing cast, average load):
graphite tip action: 20% elastic; 15% momentum; 65% leverage
cane parabolic: 25% elastic; 40% momentum; 35% leverage
Hauling can affect the share of momentum if it happens late (during rod unloading, it goes against momentum energy). Otherwise you can consider it affects the other components of line energy proportionnaly.
The share of elastic energy is higher for the cane rod because it is slower. Momentum effect is just amazing for that (tip heavy) rod.
Merlin
graphite tip action: 20% elastic; 15% momentum; 65% leverage
cane parabolic: 25% elastic; 40% momentum; 35% leverage
Hauling can affect the share of momentum if it happens late (during rod unloading, it goes against momentum energy). Otherwise you can consider it affects the other components of line energy proportionnaly.
The share of elastic energy is higher for the cane rod because it is slower. Momentum effect is just amazing for that (tip heavy) rod.
Merlin
Fly rods are like women, they won't play if they're maltreated
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
Merlin, does the model allow to have the input from caster to be the same? What are the velocity differences between tip action graphite and butt action cane? Additionally, can you separate at what point and direction each component (spring, conservation of momentum and leverage) contribute to line velocity?
I'm here just for the chicks.
-Sakke
-Sakke
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
Hi Sakke
I can do that for exactly the same input. I will use a non hauled cast and compare these rods. The line kinetic energy can be split all along the cast I think, give me some time and I shall be back with figures.
Merlin
I can do that for exactly the same input. I will use a non hauled cast and compare these rods. The line kinetic energy can be split all along the cast I think, give me some time and I shall be back with figures.
Merlin
Fly rods are like women, they won't play if they're maltreated
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
Sakke
Here are the results. The input is exactly the same, and since these rods are not designed for the same line I used as a load the normalized weight (140 grains for the graphite rod and 160 grains for the cane rod).
Although the cane rod is shorter by half a foot, it gives an impressive speed because of its huge inertial effect. This effect involves an interaction with the spring one, which is not the case for the graphite rod.
Conclusion: the energy split is completely different. As usual, there is no universal rule.
Merlin
Here are the results. The input is exactly the same, and since these rods are not designed for the same line I used as a load the normalized weight (140 grains for the graphite rod and 160 grains for the cane rod).
Although the cane rod is shorter by half a foot, it gives an impressive speed because of its huge inertial effect. This effect involves an interaction with the spring one, which is not the case for the graphite rod.
Conclusion: the energy split is completely different. As usual, there is no universal rule.
Merlin
Fly rods are like women, they won't play if they're maltreated
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
A few information, the graphics are likely difficult to understand.
Using the same rotation history (input) for such rods is not expectable. In this example, one needs more than the double of energy to cast the cane rod.
If we change the input (casting arc) to get an equivalent speed by comparison to the graphite one, we still need 60% more energy for the cane rod taken in example.
The energy budget is very different, you have to spoil a significant amount of energy (because of its swing weight) with the cane rod (nearly half; it is less than 1/3 for the graphite rod).
So modern rods are mostly levers with a limited share of spring and momentum mechanisms in normal fishing conditions.
Merlin
Using the same rotation history (input) for such rods is not expectable. In this example, one needs more than the double of energy to cast the cane rod.
If we change the input (casting arc) to get an equivalent speed by comparison to the graphite one, we still need 60% more energy for the cane rod taken in example.
The energy budget is very different, you have to spoil a significant amount of energy (because of its swing weight) with the cane rod (nearly half; it is less than 1/3 for the graphite rod).
So modern rods are mostly levers with a limited share of spring and momentum mechanisms in normal fishing conditions.
Merlin
Fly rods are like women, they won't play if they're maltreated
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
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Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
So, just so I understand as a layman, what happens to tip velocities if the energy input is the same ?
Casting Definitions
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
In this condition, the tip velocity drops to 21.2 m/s for the cane rod, to be compared to 25.7 m/s for the graphite rod.
Not surprizing IMHO.
Merlin
Not surprizing IMHO.
Merlin
Fly rods are like women, they won't play if they're maltreated
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
Charles Ritz, A Flyfisher's Life
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- Posts: 1472
- Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:57 am
Contribution rod bend/spring makes to cast
OK, thanks Daniel....I'm surprised it's that close to be honest.
Casting Definitions
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.