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Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

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nicholasfmoore
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Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#1

Post by nicholasfmoore » Mon Aug 24, 2020 3:20 pm

Hi All,

I thought it would be nice to have this in one place as I've spoken to a lot of anglers over the years and there is still confusion around this topic :cool:

I personally think all rods are 'progressive' even so called 'tip' action ones.

A rod with a fast recovery to me just means you can get to the fish/target quicker, with a slow rod, by the time you've finished the stroke the fish has died :laugh:

Really soft rods are not good for distance, you want something stiffer to reduce excessive counterflex.

Thoughts?

All the best
Nick M

"Memento Piscantur Saepe" :upside:

Thomas
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#2

Post by Thomas » Mon Aug 24, 2020 3:51 pm

Yes really soft rods are not good for distance but I am not sure counterflex is the primary reason. When you are casting a really soft rod and you rotate it really fast with a lot of line outside the tip, it is a though the rod simply does not keep up. It bends too much, for too long time, and as a consequence the cast just collapses. But I love really soft rods under the right circumstances. It takes real skill to cast such rods well.

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Lasse Karlsson
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#3

Post by Lasse Karlsson » Mon Aug 24, 2020 7:22 pm

I like these clips:



And



Mostly rod action is a matter of personal taste and tricks of the mind.

Recovery rate difference is in the thousands of a second, short lifespan for a fish 🤣

Cheers
Lasse
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http://www.karlssonflyfishing.com

***Bring Mark back!!!!!! ***

nicholasfmoore
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#4

Post by nicholasfmoore » Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:34 pm

Hi All,

Thank you for your thoughts :)
Recovery rate difference is in the thousands of a second, short lifespan for a fish 🤣
Depends how quickly it gets eaten 😜 Great videos mate, how did you hold both rods at the same time, did you tape them?
But I love really soft rods under the right circumstances. It takes real skill to cast such rods well.
It does, you don't want to hit them too hard at the end of the stroke like you would for comp distance. :cool:

All the best
Nick M

"Memento Piscantur Saepe" :upside:

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Lasse Karlsson
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#5

Post by Lasse Karlsson » Tue Aug 25, 2020 8:17 pm

nicholasfmoore wrote:
Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:34 pm
Hi All,

Thank you for your thoughts :)
Recovery rate difference is in the thousands of a second, short lifespan for a fish 🤣
Depends how quickly it gets eaten 😜 Great videos mate, how did you hold both rods at the same time, did you tape them?
😉

I had to tape the bottom of the reelseat together on those rods to keep the tips aligned. Use equal length rods these days in demos, can usually handle them without the tape 😊
But I love really soft rods under the right circumstances. It takes real skill to cast such rods well.
It does, you don't want to hit them too hard at the end of the stroke like you would for comp distance. :cool:

All the best
What happens of you hit a soft rod too hard at the end of the stroke, compared to a "comp" rod?
Asking for a friend :whistle:

Cheers
Lasse
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http://www.karlssonflyfishing.com

***Bring Mark back!!!!!! ***

nicholasfmoore
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#6

Post by nicholasfmoore » Wed Aug 26, 2020 1:54 pm

Hi Lasse,
I had to tape the bottom of the reelseat together on those rods to keep the tips aligned. Use equal length rods these days in demos, can usually handle them without the tape 😊
Nice one 'Hywell' Karlsson ;) I've never thought about taping them, i've done it before by just holding the rods in one hand, well, actually the most i've done is 4 rods. 2 in each hand :cool:
What happens of you hit a soft rod too hard at the end of the stroke, compared to a "comp" rod?
Asking for a friend :whistle:
I've just read what i've written again and that makes absolutely NO sense 😂 so sorry about that :cool:

Naturally, we want late rotation for distance for soft rods and stiff ones. Smoothness is the key for all, but i think for soft ones it becomes even more important to be accurate with your movements. For soft rods i think more of a 'heavy' movement and concentrate on being extra smooth. For anglers that don't work on technique and end up hitting it half way through translation, it will more than likely cause a tail. So what i should have said is that inappropriate application of force shows up a lot more on softer rods 😜
Mostly rod action is a matter of personal taste and tricks of the mind.
I like your point there, i do subconsciously cast stiff and soft rods differently. On my soft Hardy HBX i use thrust a lot earlier to try and limit the excessive counterflex :cool:

All the best
Nick M

"Memento Piscantur Saepe" :upside:

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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#7

Post by Paul Arden » Wed Aug 26, 2020 3:15 pm

Is that your “little friend” Lasse? :D
It's an exploration; bring a flyrod.

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Lasse Karlsson
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#8

Post by Lasse Karlsson » Wed Aug 26, 2020 4:33 pm

Paul Arden wrote:
Wed Aug 26, 2020 3:15 pm
Is that your “little friend” Lasse? :D
You don't have to put "" around yourself my little friend ;)

:D
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***Bring Mark back!!!!!! ***

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Lasse Karlsson
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#9

Post by Lasse Karlsson » Wed Aug 26, 2020 4:37 pm

nicholasfmoore wrote:
Wed Aug 26, 2020 1:54 pm
For anglers that don't work on technique and end up hitting it half way through translation, it will more than likely cause a tail. So what i should have said is that inappropriate application of force shows up a lot more on softer rods 😜


All the best
Inappropriate application of force shows up regardless of rod stiffness ;)
No such thing as a forgiving rod, just look for the tails in my clips above :blush:

Cheers
Lasse
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http://www.karlssonflyfishing.com

***Bring Mark back!!!!!! ***

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Paul Arden
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Re: Q: Fast/slow/tip/butt/stiff/soft rods

#10

Post by Paul Arden » Wed Aug 26, 2020 6:30 pm

Here’s a question for your “little friend” Lasse. :cool: Why is it if you give a beginner, or in fact 95% of casters, a comp distance outfit 10WT rod and 5MED that they can’t “make it work” but the same line on a “5WT” rod casts just fine for them?

We once cast a fibreglass POS in a Scottish shootout. I have never seen so many tails. Why did everyone who cast that rod, myself included, struggle to throw a loop that didn’t tail? (I managed to throw 115’ with that damned thing - and win! - but I would have thrown it further and easier without the line :p ).

I hope we catch up next summer mate.

Cheers,
Paul
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