Tippet breaking-tropical hot saltwater.

[James9118]

Just a reminder of the Instron testing on tippet knots that I did some time back:

Although I obviously agree with Paul about the Bimini being the strongest (you can't argue with the data) it is an impractical knot for the flats fisher. Firstly it uses up way too much leader during the tying, thus losing the taper and secondly I can't imagine tying one when stood knee deep in water. (And don't believe Paul when he says this can be done quickly and easily - I've tested his quick Bimini's, in fact I still have a perfectly good spool of 50lb mono that he gave me because it must be bad because the knots were so weak ). I've yet to meet a flats fisherman with a Bimini in their leader - that confirms to me that it's not practical - for me, I want something that's stronger than the fly knot and for me the J-knot fits the bill.

I also did an exposure to UV radiation test on the same material as used for the knot tests above. If I recall correctly, it weakened by about 10% after three months of sitting on my window sill during the summer.

James.

[Lou Bruno]

I've had nylon tippet weaken to the point were it failed when knot testing. After trying other older spools, I discovered they would fail. So, I tried newer spools, they failed. I had to scrape all of my nylon!
The reason exposure to heat and sun...be careful how you store nylon especially if your fishing in warmer climates.
We don't know the age of nylon spools when we purchase them.
I don't use chemicals, just Slavia. I try to keep my knots to minimum, and I'm not a fan of FC.

Lou

[Paul Arden]

Hi James, an interesting test would be a Slim Beauty with the tippet simply doubled over and not tied off with a Bimini. I would expect this to give excellent results and is fast to tie (although not as fast as a J-knot) but has the advantage that you can use differing diameters without issues.

I’m using a twisted leader at the moment for Snakehead fishing that I think would be excellent on the flats. It’s one piece of nylon which goes 4 strands, 2 strands, single strand. It had a J-knot locking the twists. One of my clients asked me to make a video of making the leader, which I will do ASAP.

Cheers, Paul

[Graeme H]

I use the twisted leaders often, but on the flats I tend to avoid it. The twists provide more "sparkles" as reflection points on the leaders. On the flats, I've gone back to knotted leaders for the most part.

Cheers,
Graeme

[Paul Arden]

I wonder how many people carry mud on the flats Just me maybe?!

[Limpe Iven]

Thanks for the input sofar! Very helpful!

Been practicing differents knots, would make for a great challenge, time limited leader to tippet knotting contest....

Any prefered leader formulas?
Or is it a matter of adapting the leader to the style of fishing? If so, what to watch for? How to adapt?

I noticed several conditions that-with being able to adapt quick- would provide for more fish, or at least a better attempt..
For instance; deeper water (>3FT), would ask for a longer thinner tippet wich sinks faster, helping the fly getting to the bottom faster (and staying there). Having a thick floating butt section helps the fly getting upwards when retrieving while you need it to remain on the bottom.

Really shallow water (<1 FT); extremely long leader-tippet to present the unweighted fly tip-toe style with extremely spooky fish.
adapting the leader could help with a nicer turn-over of the fly, contributing to a softer presentation.
(also, the longer leader with a serious breeze head on and from the side and a unweighted fly asked for an adapted casting style, but working on that..)


How do you adapt to these two?
What should be considered? what section does what?

Interesting, this leader knowledge!

[Paul Arden]

There are some very good questions in there. Me personally I try not to make too many leader adjustments and if I need more depth I would rather simply change to a heavier fly. There are obviously times when an Intermediate sink tip is a better choice for this sort of versatility.

I do not consider myself to be a very experienced SW angler. I might only have put around 3 or 400 days into tropical SW. I plan to dramatically change this in about five years from now.

For my leaders in the tropics I typically use a butt section of around 5ft of 40lb leader and then tippet of 8 or 9 ft of 16lbs - might be too clunky for Bonefish? I don’t know I’ve only fished for those in the Maldives so far.

I use a 5 turn nail knot for the 40lbs to flyline. I’ve never had this slip in the Salt but I have had it fail for Snakehead where I now always build a loop in the flyline end. The nice thing about the nail knot is that it travels reasonably well through the rings, which is important if you have a longer leader. My leaders for SW and most streamer fishing is around 1.5 times the length of the rod.

Having written this I’m pretty sure that a twisted leader has many advantages over the 40lb butt. In particular they don’t kink as readily. Graeme’s point about flash is interesting (and I really do carry mud on the flats ).

There is a leader that I use for Gourami which is braid (it’s complicated and involves splicing hollow braid to form a taper and then impregnating varnish and linseed oil to give it weight - Graeme came up with this idea while sleeping). The tippet itself is also braid. I believe that these leaders can completely transform fishing particularly in rocky or coral areas. Of course attaching flies to anything other than clear monofilament or Fluorocarbon might prove a challenge for some people’s imagination But if it works for static dry flies and highly challenging fish then I’m quite sure it will work in the Salt.

Cheers, Paul

[Limpe Iven]

Field testing as we speak, so far my improved knots seem to hold up pretty well


Tiemco 811S hook, they do bend !

[Graeme H]

Nice knot! Shame about the hook though - ditch SS hooks ... they are terrible.

Cheers,
Graeme

[Limpe Iven]

Just got home from the flats.
After some serious testing my conclusion is this.
The tippet material i used on the previous trip from where my problems started was the issue.
Can't pinpoint the date of purchase and/or manufacturing but do know that this was the problem.

with the same material;
fresh leader/fresh knot > no problem
fresh leader/fresh knot, in the water for 30 minutes and leaving it in the sun resulted in immediate breaking of the leader to tippet knot, breaking right after the knot and leaving the knot on the leader.
don't worry, didnt test it on a fish, used a piece of heavy rock instead, gradually applying pressure was no problem, whem mimicing a strip-strike it broke every time.

Also, tried the uv knot sense stuff, useless in my opinion, just leaves a big klump on the leader, might be usefull for minor repairs tough. for waders

Furthermore, using mud helped for the situations where the fish where really spooky, thanks Paul, for this tip, had never tought of using it on the flats, will never leave home without it!


And Greame; will try a different brand/type of hook, heard some good feedback on the Daichi X-point hooks.