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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

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rowch
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#1

Post by rowch » Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:48 am

This is where I probably need to start.

I have a Winston 9' 5wt IBIS - boron rod. Generally, I use a WF line and more recently a RIO Intouch Outbound Short (IOS).

Adjusting to the IBIS was not too difficult as it is quite soft, after using a glass rod for 40 years.

Fishing where I do (mostly), the water is backed by a steep rocky embankment, it is often windy and a steeple cast is necessary. As a rule, I use a washing line rig with two buzzers / emergers and a strike indicator on the point - this does vary, depending on conditions, replacing the indicator with a Caddis emerger.

I'm not sure about the IOS. The idea was to minimise casts and get the line out with a single or very few false casts (to avoid the rocks) but I am having difficulty with this combination. Though perhaps, I'm trying too hard and expecting too much of the rod and line. Perhaps, a mismatch of rod and line but more likely the practitioner.

Given that I do not intend replacing the rod - what of the line combination and technique? It's not that I need to cast all that far, though that would be good on occasions. The outfit just feels unbalanced and hard to coordinate smoothly.

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Paul Arden
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#2

Post by Paul Arden » Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:01 am

Hi Rowland,

I’m going to be honest and have problems with these sorts of lines, particularly when it comes to turnover. How far do you have to cast in these situations? Is it possible to Roll Cast?

I suspect you are getting a huge bend in the rod and the stroke is by necessity slow? Instead of going up in line weight, which is in essence what the OBS is (two line weights I believe), I would rely on using more speed in the Casting Stroke.

Are you stopping/checking the shoot to force turnover? Steeple Casts always make life difficult - the sharper the upward angle the more the line will want to dive down on the forward cast. And it’s going to be particularly hard with a heavy/soft combination.

Cheers Paul
It's an exploration; bring a flyrod.

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rowch
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#3

Post by rowch » Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:30 am

Hi Paul.

Casting distance is between 40 - 50 feet (a good one), limited by the dynamics of the outfit. Roll casts inevitably tangle the leaders and droppers.

There is no stop/check, as I would on level ground with a DT for instance; and you are right, a big bend in the rod and slow. Roll over is unreliable.

I have a standard RIO WF wt 5 and it is easier to manage but distance, say 30 - 40 feet, excluding leader and tippet, is hard work. At best I may shoot 10 to 15' of running line on a really good coordinated cast.

It's still water with fluctuating water levels. The best fish feed over the deeper water 10+ feet within 2 and 4' of the surface. So distance to deeper water at times, otherwise the good fish are out of reach until sundown.

rowch
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Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:35 am

Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#4

Post by rowch » Fri Jun 08, 2018 4:59 am

I'm thinking that I should opt for the Winston Energy line, although they are designed for the faster Boron rods. The Scientific Anglers Mastery MPX?

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Paul Arden
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#5

Post by Paul Arden » Fri Jun 08, 2018 5:32 am

I'm suspicious of any line that is "designed for faster rods" as being overweight, Rowland. One of the problems with heavy short heads is once they start shooting they often need the caster to stop the shoot to get a nice turnover. The other problem I find is that when they are short they will unroll very quickly, which can also lead to a collapse. It could be a great case for a DHD by the way - I know Matt wrote just such a page a few weeks ago.

Another alternative would be to make up your own shooting head. This will give you control over the length of the head, and its weight. I used to fish similar situations on steep dam walls. Depending on the wind it was sometimes possible to cast further by angling the cast at 45 degrees to the wall. The other option was to try to backcast over the top of the wall, which was particularly difficult to accomplish when the water levels were low.

Cheers, Paul
It's an exploration; bring a flyrod.

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Paul Arden
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#6

Post by Paul Arden » Fri Jun 08, 2018 5:39 am

And yes - the point fly will make that leader very difficult to Roll Cast!
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ACW
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#7

Post by ACW » Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:09 am

EDR-F XS-Plus ED Roll-Cast Line
I have been using one of these ,from Snowbee.
sadly they only go down to #6.
My local resser has become a weekend destination for general public often with massive family groups of all ages from buggy borne babys through folks who walk slower than i do and thats slow.
roll casts with this line and 15-20 foot 3 fly leaders have meant i can cast even when i have a wall of "visitors" :666: behind me .
mind you i am using a 10 ft #6 rod ,I get very few tangles ensuring that the point fly is the biggets and most aerodynamic getting smaller and bushier is the go up the leader toward the fly line .

years ago I would have used a DT for similar situations .

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Graeme H
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#8

Post by Graeme H » Fri Jun 08, 2018 1:19 pm

I'm certainly no expert in the type of fishing you're describing, but I do know I dislike the Rio OBS. I still use them sometimes for short distance casting with heavy flies while seated in my kayak, but I tend to avoid it wherever I can. Even so, a 48' cast is just the 30' of head plus 9' of rod and 9' of leader.

Are there other things you can change? Is it vital to use the team of flies? You might be able to get closer to the zone with a simpler terminal setup.

Is the steeple cast actually the only option? I've recently started playing with the Rio Single Hand Spey line. A 50' roll cast is quite easy with it. Any of the single hand spey casts to 60' are also very easy to achieve without a haul. If you even have 20' of space behind you, I'd suggest one of these casts may be a solution than the steeple cast.

Cheers,
Graeme
FFi CCI

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Paul Arden
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#9

Post by Paul Arden » Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:43 pm

Hi Rowland,

Something you could try is tying the point fly with some lead and then compensate that with more foam. Then you might have a fly that you can roll casts and still fishes in the way you want.

Cheers, Paul
It's an exploration; bring a flyrod.

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rowch
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Casting - RIO Intouch Outbound Short - Boron rod

#10

Post by rowch » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:42 pm

Thanks Paul ACW and Graeme. All thoughtful options. A good starting point is the Rio OBS line. Clearly, not the best option. The rod line combination is not optimal but then I may be expecting too much from my gear.

I need to do some line comparisons. I still have a regular Rio #5 WF and access to a Scientific Anglers WF #5 with the new slick coating and should have a closer look at the EDR-F XS-Plus ED Roll-Cast Line and investigate Spey casting, which is entirely new to me.

I prefer to stick with the washing line leader set up and multiple flies because it works so well. A heavier point fly does improve roll over, but overall the cast is a weight lifting exercise, more so than with a regular RIO WF line.

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