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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

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Boisker
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#1

Post by Boisker » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:18 pm

I was messing about with this earlier...
And having gone through the usual casting process of constantly tailing to learning how to cast ‘correctly’... I can’t now seem to purposely throw a tail.
Obviously I know how to in principle, but they ain’t tailing :D
I mostly tried overpowering at the end of the stroke, I can make it tail, but only by absolutely slamming the end of the cast, but that looks nothing like an actual genuine casting fault :closedeyes:

It’s surprisingly tricky to do well, any advice /tips?

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James9118
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#2

Post by James9118 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:24 pm

After the backcast, position the rod at 90 degrees to the line (you could call this creep if it wasn't intentional :D ), i.e. don't drift so that the rod is pointing down the line. This way any movement of the rod forwards flexes the tip, not lower down in the rod. You still need an uneven power application but this can be quite subtle if you're flexing the tip.

Boisker
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#3

Post by Boisker » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:30 pm

Thanks James I’ll try that.... it’s amusing how hard it is, especially when thinking just how easy it used to be :D
Perhaps I should try it with a ‘shit load’ more line out, I probably had 30’ out when I was trying this afternoon... the only time I get “wind knots” these days is if I try practicing distance :D :D :D

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Paul Arden
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#4

Post by Paul Arden » Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:04 pm

Many years ago when the CCI required a tailing loop the easiest way was for people to spike the force upwards at the end of the stroke. The committees then had a problem with that because that’s not how most people throw tails. However if you want to throw a tail this is the easiest way - and there are reasons to actually use them (off plane of course). So that’s the easist way - spike the force and aim up.

Nowadays you are expected to show other ways too. And it’s actually quite difficult to get good at each of the faults and separate them (apart from which being wholly unnecessary IMO!). Learning this one first however will help!

Cheers, Paul
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James9118
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#5

Post by James9118 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:15 pm

Power spikes at the end of the forward casting stoke give early (and not really that typical) tails. A subtle dip of the tip right at the start of the forward casting stroke gives a late tail - if it's really very subtle it will 'catch' in the leader, not the fly line. It's maybe good to practice both to demonstrate control.

Boisker
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#6

Post by Boisker » Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:36 pm

It was reading the CI test requirements that got me inquisitive enough to try it... I can’t really seeing it having any useful purpose for me, but since I’ve found it isn’t that easy and that I couldn’t automatically do it I now want to be able to cast tails....
Makes no sense, but it’s something to play with and I guess can only help further develop rod control :D

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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#7

Post by Mangrove Cuckoo » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:58 pm

Being able to duplicate your student's tailing error, and then producing a good loop on the next cast, is a fantastic way to demonstrate to them what they are doing wrong. Especially if you alternate back and forth explaining what you are doing. And, very difficult to do!

If I remember right, when I took my tests, you were supposed to create tails three different ways?

None of them looked like the ones I saw my students producing!

I saw a lot of late tails on saltwater casters. At first, it seemed to correspond to casters with very strong hands and/or thick wrists. So, I always thought it had to do mostly with overpowering. Now, I think I agree with James: it is not all about the overpowering but also it is the lowering of the rod tip on the beginning of the stroke as they cock their wrist backwards in preparation to release the hammer.

But it is funny, isn't it, how hard it is to make a tail after trying for so long to remove them!
“Very simple man. Catching fish makes me happy. Scaringly simple.”

Håvard Stubø

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Graeme H
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#8

Post by Graeme H » Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:36 pm

A good way to ensure a tail is to aim the preceding back cast a bit higher than normal. When you make the forward cast, any error that otherwise would give you a slight tail will produce a horrendous one! :)

It works because breaking the 180° rule in the vertical plane is one of the reasons a tail is formed. It's an incorrect application of power caused by disturbing the direction of power rather than the amplitude of power. That 180° rule is not usually cited as a reason for a tail during the CCI exam, since the "general wisdom" (in the CCI exam) is that only three causes of tails are known:

* Creep,
* Insufficient casting arc and
* An "incorrect application of power", nearly always demonstrated as "hitting it too early".

In my view, creep causes an insufficient arc and an insufficient arc is one manifestation of an incorrect application of power. In other words, all of these are the same thing caused by different mechanisms. But I digress .... :)

Finishing a haul too early is another cause of a tail (also incorrect application of power) and breaking the 180° Rule is the other common one. Together, those give you 5 methods of forming a tail.

To summarise, enhance your tail by misdirecting your back cast.

Cheers,
Graeme

(BTW, that high back cast was my problem at intermediate casting level. Morsie pointed it out for me, which allowed me to fix it. At first, he struggled to see where the problem was because the casting action looked fine. From a distance, he could see where I was going wrong though.)
IFFF CCI

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Paul Arden
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#9

Post by Paul Arden » Thu Feb 14, 2019 3:38 am

I know that the tailing timing is early=late and late=early, but if I want to collapse the line end for a tuck-cast variation or curved cast then I still spike late in the stroke. Of all the causes of tails it's really the only one where I can control the line layout consistently.

I'm pretty sure that they are in this video http://www.sexyloops.com/flycast/tailing-loops/

Cheers, Paul
It's an exploration; bring a flyrod.

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Boisker
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How to cast a tailing loop ‘on command’

#10

Post by Boisker » Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:17 am

Thanks Paul... I should have checked the vids first!
It’s nice and sunny out I’ll have another play later....

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