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George C wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 12:24 pm
I suspect 99% of the guys casting a fly rod have no concept of the need to get the line ‘positioned right’, nor even what ‘right’ entails. It is just not emphasized (at least from what I’ve seen/read) as an essential concept. It seems, rather, that instruction is aimed at making it happen indirectly without the caster realizing it is a major determinant of what is to follow.
I would suggest that this occurs because the fly fishing world is fixated on rods, when we are casting lines. Switching to line cues when teaching makes life so much easier. It’s an invaluable source of feedback for the caster that allows you to make cast adjustments in real time.
regards
Vince
Wow-this is golf to a T. Does the swing create the shot or does the shot create the swing? The game used to be taught where the players sensed the weight and movement of the club head, now the movement of the club head is an indirect result of body positions and body motion.
Is the objective of a golf stroke to throw the club Phil?
regards
Vince
“Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius — and a lot of courage — to move in the opposite direction.” — Ernst F. Schumacher
I remember I had a different opinion on this; also because I tried different line configurations with (almost) the same mass. For an overhead cast they feel very similar to me during the acceleration phase (I've tried to keep the fly leg straight). The inertial mass of the two line configurations is the same. I'd say once you deviate from the straight line / 180° principle you'll feel the difference, e.g. a static roll cast is such an example - more mass close to the tip. I can also feel a difference while the line is unrolling, this is related to change of momentum, something that Gordy likes to quote
Greetings,
Torsten
Paul Arden wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 5:16 am
George sums it up it perfectly with James’ understanding I think. So they will feel quite different. Imagine the same mass but condensed into a bubble float, or lead weight, at one extreme, compared to a very light and long DT of the same total mass. That’s going to feel very different (the DT will feel much lighter, even though it’s the same total mass).
Cheers, Paul
I followed up the initial discussion with some practical tests. Using a 'weak link' in my S55 shooting head outfit, I determined that I could apply more force (by the fact the weak link snapped) with a 55g weight than with a 55g fly line. The difference was stark, no matter how aggressive I made the cast with the fly line I couldn't break the link that ruptured easily with the weight. This result, to me, added credence to the thought that with a distributed mass (i.e. a long line) the inertia is not felt in the same way as for a point mass.
I also requested that others try the same test, but I don't think anyone did.
For sure. I believe that the total head weight of a MED5 is 19.4G, which is heavier than a 10WT shooting head. It certainly feels a lot lighter in the air to me.
Yes it was very revealing James. Hope you’re having a great week!
I’m happy I asked the question! You guys have some very deep intense thoughts which leads me to believe, I’m more confused now than I was before. I’ll be throwing 100+ feet accurately eventually just not in my time which should have been yesterday .
James9118 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 17, 2024 12:51 pm
I followed up the initial discussion with some practical tests. Using a 'weak link' in my S55 shooting head outfit, I determined that I could apply more force (by the fact the weak link snapped) with a 55g weight than with a 55g fly line. The difference was stark, no matter how aggressive I made the cast with the fly line I couldn't break the link that ruptured easily with the weight. This result, to me, added credence to the thought that with a distributed mass (i.e. a long line) the inertia is not felt in the same way as for a point mass.
I also requested that others try the same test, but I don't think anyone did.
James
Hi James
I did it with a seatrout ST27 outfit, got same result. And casting an near infinite amount of line configuŕations have lead me to the same conclusions.
Cheers
Lasse
Your friendly neighbourhood flyslinger
Flycasting, so simple that instructors need to make it complicated since 1685
Lasse Karlsson wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 10:16 am
That casters prefer short weights to long weights is a given, its alot harder to have a long weight positioned right, than to get a short one in the right place. Has nothing really to do with the rod, everything to do with the caster
Cheers
Lasse
Lasse
So is this why I find any rod/line combo I use more let’s say “user friendly” when using a -40 foot head vs. a +50’ head in the wind?
Hi Vinny
Sorry I missed this one, short answer is yes
Cheers
Lasse
Your friendly neighbourhood flyslinger
Flycasting, so simple that instructors need to make it complicated since 1685
Lasse
Thanks for the follow up. I used both my HT8s the last few days with winds coming from my 6 at +-3 on 13. One has a GS on the other a Ballistic pro with a 60’ head. I can definitely feel a difference. Now if I could adjust my sensitivity to hanging 70+’ out there so it feels like the GS I’d be making progress. I need to practice more that’s a FACT!!
I appreciate you guys!
Vinny
. I’ll be throwing 100+ feet accurately eventually just not in my time which should have been yesterday 
.
let’s say “user friendly” when using a -40 foot head vs. a +50’ head in the wind?
