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Leaders, how and why
Moderators: Viking Lars, Magnus
Leaders, how and why
Hi boys and girls,
over at another (Norwegian) forum I discussed leader design and leader materials. I find this topic quite interesting, and it is also important when it comes to catching fish
So guys what are you using and why? Mono, furled, braided or poly? Tie your own or tapered?
If mono, what kind of mono? Soft or stiff? And do you "boil" your leaders to soften the material and remove memory?
Personally I do (usually) tie my own leaders, and I've been using the "Borger Uni-body" system since read about it in "Presentation" back in 1994 or something. My (trout) leaders are generally build from just three mono diameters 0.50mm, 0.35mm and 0.25mm + tippet (which usually starts at 0.20mm and is tapered down to smaller diameters if necessary). This system is very flexible, and changing the leader completely for a different task is quick and easily done on site.
Unlike Mr. Borger I don't use Maxima Camelon in my leaders anymore, I prefer softer monos and I sometimes "boil" (with dish detergents added to the water, a trick I got from Christan split the cane Strixner) the butts of my leaders to remove memory and make them as soft as possible.
Some interesting leader links:
http://flyalf.wordpress.com/2012/05/18/ ... -leader-2/
http://fishfliesandwater.com/gear-riggi ... for-trout/
Cheers,
Grunde
over at another (Norwegian) forum I discussed leader design and leader materials. I find this topic quite interesting, and it is also important when it comes to catching fish
So guys what are you using and why? Mono, furled, braided or poly? Tie your own or tapered?
If mono, what kind of mono? Soft or stiff? And do you "boil" your leaders to soften the material and remove memory?
Personally I do (usually) tie my own leaders, and I've been using the "Borger Uni-body" system since read about it in "Presentation" back in 1994 or something. My (trout) leaders are generally build from just three mono diameters 0.50mm, 0.35mm and 0.25mm + tippet (which usually starts at 0.20mm and is tapered down to smaller diameters if necessary). This system is very flexible, and changing the leader completely for a different task is quick and easily done on site.
Unlike Mr. Borger I don't use Maxima Camelon in my leaders anymore, I prefer softer monos and I sometimes "boil" (with dish detergents added to the water, a trick I got from Christan split the cane Strixner) the butts of my leaders to remove memory and make them as soft as possible.
Some interesting leader links:
http://flyalf.wordpress.com/2012/05/18/ ... -leader-2/
http://fishfliesandwater.com/gear-riggi ... for-trout/
Cheers,
Grunde
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful."
George E. P. Box
Always question the assumptions!
Flycasting Definitions
...
George E. P. Box
Always question the assumptions!
Flycasting Definitions
...
- Bernd Ziesche
- Posts: 3436
- Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:01 pm
- Location: Whereever the fish are!
- Contact:
Re: Leaders, how and why
Hi Grunde,
if I want my leader to:
sink = fluorocarbon
swimm = stanadard monofilament
stiff = Maxima (Cameleon in dark coloured water, Ultragreen in clear water)
soft = Stroft GTM
abrasion proof = fluorocarbon
almost invisible in clear (sunny) water conditions = fluorocarbon by Riverge
not stretchable = Maxima or fluorocarbon
very stretchable = different alternatives (for example Stroft)
Polyleaders mostly for:
- being able to adjust the turnover to the fly (heavy or light ones)
- in general getting a smoother turnover on some pretty short head lines
- adjusting density profile to current and stones of the river
The old Ritz formula: 60/20/20 for some dry fly leaders in general.
In case of thin standard mono and fluorocarbon I use small rings to connect ("Pitzenbauer rings").
I do boil leaders if I want them to be very straight and especially if I have to reel them up often. Memory is less on boiled monofilament leaders (agree).
Greets
Bernd
if I want my leader to:
sink = fluorocarbon
swimm = stanadard monofilament
stiff = Maxima (Cameleon in dark coloured water, Ultragreen in clear water)
soft = Stroft GTM
abrasion proof = fluorocarbon
almost invisible in clear (sunny) water conditions = fluorocarbon by Riverge
not stretchable = Maxima or fluorocarbon
very stretchable = different alternatives (for example Stroft)
Polyleaders mostly for:
- being able to adjust the turnover to the fly (heavy or light ones)
- in general getting a smoother turnover on some pretty short head lines
- adjusting density profile to current and stones of the river
The old Ritz formula: 60/20/20 for some dry fly leaders in general.
In case of thin standard mono and fluorocarbon I use small rings to connect ("Pitzenbauer rings").
I do boil leaders if I want them to be very straight and especially if I have to reel them up often. Memory is less on boiled monofilament leaders (agree).
Greets
Bernd
http://www.first-cast.de
The first cast is always the best cast.
The first cast is always the best cast.
Re: Leaders, how and why
I did this a while back to illustrate my set up with a floating line for loch style fishing.
Way back we had a debate about the "superglue connection". Well I used it all last season and it was superb. Having inspected the connection recently on my 6wt will continue with the same one. When it gives up the ghost I'll report back.
On rivers for dry fly I still use thread furled leaders usually with just a lever length of tippet of 3 to 4 feet. If I feel the need for longer finer tippets I'll put a step into it.
The boiling idea is something I hadn't come across before. I'll tuck that one away for future reference.
Cheers,
C.
Way back we had a debate about the "superglue connection". Well I used it all last season and it was superb. Having inspected the connection recently on my 6wt will continue with the same one. When it gives up the ghost I'll report back.
On rivers for dry fly I still use thread furled leaders usually with just a lever length of tippet of 3 to 4 feet. If I feel the need for longer finer tippets I'll put a step into it.
The boiling idea is something I hadn't come across before. I'll tuck that one away for future reference.
Cheers,
C.
- Bernd Ziesche
- Posts: 3436
- Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:01 pm
- Location: Whereever the fish are!
- Contact:
Re: Leaders, how and why
Thanks Craig,
I have just stolen your picture!
Greets
Bernd
I have just stolen your picture!
Greets
Bernd
http://www.first-cast.de
The first cast is always the best cast.
The first cast is always the best cast.
Re: Leaders, how and why
Are you saying that boiling your leader has a permanent effect on memory? I always assumed you would have to boil each time.
Cheers
Trev
Cheers
Trev
Re: Leaders, how and why
Thanks guys!
Very nice figure Craig (I've also stored a copy )
The softening effect of boiling lasts for quite a while, I usually don't repeat, just change the butt section after a while. Also with soft mono (like Sufix XL which I've heard is very soft and nice for leaders) one don't need to boil them
Cheers,
Grunde
Very nice figure Craig (I've also stored a copy )
The softening effect of boiling lasts for quite a while, I usually don't repeat, just change the butt section after a while. Also with soft mono (like Sufix XL which I've heard is very soft and nice for leaders) one don't need to boil them
Cheers,
Grunde
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful."
George E. P. Box
Always question the assumptions!
Flycasting Definitions
...
George E. P. Box
Always question the assumptions!
Flycasting Definitions
...
- Bernd Ziesche
- Posts: 3436
- Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:01 pm
- Location: Whereever the fish are!
- Contact:
Leaders, how and why
Hi Trev,
I can't tell you if boiling has the same effect on all monofilament leaders. But those I used for the exam were constantly much straighter after boiling. I could reel them up, keep them for a night on the reel and pull of an almost straight leader. Much better than it was (on the exact same leaders) without boiling and just by stretching via hand.
Memomery always fully came back without boiling.
Usually I never cared much about boiling or not. But that made me really think if maybe I should boil all my leaders once. Need further testings...
Greets
Bernd
I can't tell you if boiling has the same effect on all monofilament leaders. But those I used for the exam were constantly much straighter after boiling. I could reel them up, keep them for a night on the reel and pull of an almost straight leader. Much better than it was (on the exact same leaders) without boiling and just by stretching via hand.
Memomery always fully came back without boiling.
Usually I never cared much about boiling or not. But that made me really think if maybe I should boil all my leaders once. Need further testings...
Greets
Bernd
http://www.first-cast.de
The first cast is always the best cast.
The first cast is always the best cast.
Leaders, how and why
Hmmm. I always thought it was a temporary fix. I might give it a try too.
By the way, what outfit did you use for the exam?
Cheers
T
By the way, what outfit did you use for the exam?
Cheers
T
-
- Posts: 213
- Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:49 pm
- Location: near North Wales, UK
Leaders, how and why
For dryfly I use shop-bought tapered: usually Hardy co-polymer, but at EWF 2012 I picked-up some Stroft GTM tapered leaders. I was dying a couple of lines with Rit, and added to the dye-bath a Hardy and a Stroft tapered leader. Both now a subtle brown and very supple: the Stroft tapered leaders are especially supple anyway, and turnover (tested by handcasting the leader alone) is excellent.
Andrew
PS Craig is Alan
Andrew
PS Craig is Alan
Leaders, how and why
A book I just received is specifically about leaders. I'm afraid I have not read it yet, reading 3 others first, but it appears to be very informative. Along with the drag free drift it has chapters on leader dynamics, rod flex, leader elements, leader construction, etc. About 160 pages. Also includes a leaderCalc, leader tying software CD-Rom by Schweitzer (over 1000 formula combinations). I look forward to reading it. You may also find some useful information.
Drag-Free Drift
Leader Design and Presentation Techniques for Fly Fishing
Author: Joseph A Kissane
Drag-Free Drift
Leader Design and Presentation Techniques for Fly Fishing
Author: Joseph A Kissane