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Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

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Lasse Karlsson
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#161

Post by Lasse Karlsson » Sat Nov 21, 2020 7:30 am

Paul Arden wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:54 am

There does seem to be rather a lot of people casting with the wind nowadays :D Me personally I’m not impressed with anything that is wind assisted. I feel like I’m in a minority here but that’s not going to change. That’s just a case of who has the biggest wind :laugh:

Cheers,
Paul
Flyfishing, the home of snobs since it started :D
If one just threw longer , you would have used one of your hurricanes to beat everyone, truth is, casting with the wind requires skill. Just like casting into the wind does and with the wind from the sides. If you truly didn't, then you would only count indoors where we all cast together in a small venue...

Cheers
Lasse
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http://www.karlssonflyfishing.com

***Bring Mark back!!!!!! ***

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James9118
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#162

Post by James9118 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:20 pm

Paul Arden wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:54 am
That’s just a case of who has the biggest wind :laugh:
Hi Paul, I think you know that simply isn't true, especially with something like #5 trout distance. My distance drops off a cliff if the wind gets too strong, i.e. the point where I can't get a MED into overhang on the backcast. My 'perfect' wind will differ from others, however it's the same people who win casting comps irrespective of the conditions on the day.

Cheers, James

Mangrove Cuckoo
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#163

Post by Mangrove Cuckoo » Sat Nov 21, 2020 2:43 pm

A great drill that is most important to fish in Florida with our open water and almost constant wind is to place a ring in the middle of a field to practice accuracy. The finer point of the drill is to slowly move around the ring, clockwise then anticlockwise, and continue to place the fly inside it while you experience the wind from every direction.
"Technique is the proof of your seriousness"

Wallace Stevens

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Paul Arden
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#164

Post by Paul Arden » Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:24 pm

I don’t discount the wind because I find it difficult. In fact I think a gale will suit me better than most. I just discount it because it’s a meaningless number unless everyone experiences the same! Twice I’ve been in the WC finals with casts of around 115’. You go out one day and throw 115. You go out the next and throw 135. What does that tell you?

In athletics they discount records set with wind, despite the fact that you might need some “extra technique” to deal with it.

But I’m definitely in a minority here :D It’s not like we haven’t been doing this for 20 years.

There are very few people who can with a 5WT throw 120’ without wind. 130’ is massive. 140’ completely impossible.

It’s the same with altitude by the way. But less so. But there again I’ve never been that interested in numbers. I can’t tell you for example my longest cast. Absolutely no idea :D

Cheers, Paul
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Phil Blackmar
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#165

Post by Phil Blackmar » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:03 pm

Hi Paul-

Back to practice...

Structured practice is good, but the focus of each practice or section of each practice must match your needs and intent. For instance:
1. Technical/Mechanical
2. Repeatability/Feel
2. Distance/Power
3. Accuracy
4. Preparing to compete-use of baselines, pressure, situational variances etc
5. Mental

As with all sports, the mental side is as important as any of the other. Whether it's casting at a sighted fish, spot in a stream or for competition, optimal performance comes from a heightened awareness and focus while simultaneously staying physically and emotionally relaxed. This is an oxymoron for most people as the harder they focus, the harder they try and more they tighten up. However, with some work it can be trained. The problem is, in today's "tell me what I'm doing wrong so I can do well today" world, most people lack the dedication or commitment to carry thru with effectively working on a mental game.

You said "Enlightenment" describing a feeling you must get when working on accuracy going from target to target. The ZONE. The zone is the ultimate heightened self and spatial awareness accompanied by a tremendous calm and sense of righteousness. It's a place misunderstood by most people. As a result, most people have no idea how they end up in the zone. I was fortunate to be trained, while in college, be two Olympic swimmers on a program which would put me in a transcendent place, like the zone. All my practice session employ a degree of this program. If you wish, I can email you something I have written describing the process. Fly casting has replaced golf in this way for me!

Putting together a structured practice needs to allow room for adjustment based on self awareness. Some days we have more patience than others. Some days we are more calm than others. Some days we are more coordinated than others. etc etc. Adjusting and tailoring a session allows for the most benefit.

These ideas and tenants played a huge role in my 16 year career on the PGA Tour. At 6'7", my skill and ability at repeating shots was substandard at best. But, the tour is all about taking advantage of situations, something I luckily realized early on.

As for wind.....it's amazing when throwing for distance the difference a slight breeze in vs away can make in the lay out and reach of a cast.....just saying. Give me 5 mph down and left to right and I'm feeling a false sense of machismo. LOL. :) :) :)

Love the drill Mangrove Cuckoo

Cheers
Phil

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Paul Arden
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#166

Post by Paul Arden » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:51 am

If you wish, I can email you something I have written describing the process.
Yes please! I’d love to read that. I’m usually pretty good under pressure. But there are a few reasons for that. One is for decades I’ve taken a rod outside to relax. Working online, need a break, and I’ll pick up the rod and go for a throw.

Another is I started giving public demos to large audiences at fairs with a microphone 25 years ago and it scared the absolute shit out of me! Two things came from that. One was realising that excitement and dread feelings are the same, it’s just a different mental perspective. And the other is that when I cast in public and don’t have the mic then it is easy!

I also played a lot of competitive rugby when I was younger. So I guess it’s in the blood.

One of the problems we have in flycasting is that we don’t have enough competitions. I haven’t had a serious comp for two years. Mind you living in the jungle and Covid played a part in that. But I do put a lot of stress on having mini competitions in casting practise. For example we often get into a groove when casting. My longest distance casts come after about an hour, after ten minutes on the rings I should be hitting them all, but what is the use of that? :D You get 2-4 minutes in distance comp and first ring counts in accuracy.

And I think some people forget that - It’s a great skill to throw 120’ but can you do it in 2 minutes from cold?

Very interesting that you are looking to move to that mental state in comp. I’d never considered actively seeking it, only that it comes when you are in the zone. That’s obviously something I can work on! Thanks :)

Paul
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Paul Arden
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#167

Post by Paul Arden » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:13 am

Incidentally I think it makes a lot more sense to be a professional golfer than flycaster. :laugh: It will be interesting to see what similarities there are to the golf swing. Interestingly I found a lot of similarities to playing pool. Tracking, focus, sighting, stance. Of course that game is also quite close to Chess in terms of strategy.

Cheers, Paul
It's an exploration; bring a flyrod.

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Dirk le Roux
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#168

Post by Dirk le Roux » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:14 am

Paul Arden wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:51 am
It’s a great skill to throw 120’ but can you do it in 2 minutes from cold?
Hi Paul

I was very interested to learn of Dr Dave Alfred's approach to training/practice (he is particular about the distinction but I can't now remember which is which). He limits the athlete to sets of the minimum chances, then go on to another exercise. NO chance of "just one more shot"!

Cheers,
Dirk

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Paul Arden
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#169

Post by Paul Arden » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:47 pm

It’s an interesting topic, Dirk, because I think most flycasters don’t train to compete, they simply train their casting. And that change is very significant. You need a game plan!

I’ll do a bit of Googling and have a look for Dr Alfred.

Thanks, Paul
It's an exploration; bring a flyrod.

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John Waters
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Re: Tracking ... tracking ... tracking

#170

Post by John Waters » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:28 pm

I think casters need to structure each 12 month period the same as athletes in other sports do. Divide the year into basically three segments, an off-season, a pre-competition and a competition seasons. Depending on the caster, both the off-season and the pre-competition season needs to individualised to each caster's stage of development and level of performance recently achieved, but in general, should incorporate segments that cover technique, strength, flexibility, both mind and physical preparedness and event planning. The shorter of the two, the competition season, can be less individualised to each caster because of the of the fact that each competition in any sport, including casting, is standardised and the training for that period should be structured accordingly, however key segments would include event preparedness, time segmentation and performance review. There are segments of each season that continue over the full 12 month period but with intensity and duration variations for each.

The extensive, scientific based research that other sports have developed over many, many decades, compared to the little undertaken by casting, indicates to me that casting can learn much about technique, training and performance.

Dirk and Paul are both correct. As a wise man once said, "practice does not make perfect, only perfect practice makes perfect".

John

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