Double Haul timing

Double Haul timing

Post Number:#121  Postby gordonjudd » Wed Dec 05, 2018 3:57 pm

I would want to know its initial momentum not it's initial KE

Vince,
And what direction would you use for the velocity part of the momentum calculation?
Gordy
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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#122  Postby VGB » Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:29 pm

gordonjudd wrote:
I would want to know its initial momentum not it's initial KE

Vince,
And what direction would you use for the velocity part of the momentum calculation?
Gordy


Gordy

Initially, the direction I am aiming the cannon.

Vince
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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#123  Postby Michal Duzynski » Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:44 pm

VGB wrote:
Michal Duzynski wrote:Rotate-haul as late as possible- put this in their heads.


Hi Mike

You’re overthinking this

Regards

Vince

Yes , I agree. I think I am known for that. Even my wife tells me this often.

I will keep reading and try to understand.
Meanwhile I will keep doing what Paul does.

Cheers
Mike
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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#124  Postby VGB » Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:50 pm

Michal Duzynski wrote:
I will keep reading and try to understand.
Meanwhile I will keep doing what Paul does.

Cheers
Mike


Don’t use his tape measure :D

Regards

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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#125  Postby Paul Arden » Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:40 am

Hi Mike,

I’m pretty sure that the flycasting has always been learn it and then try to work out how it works. I’ve always been interested in how it works but I think if you want to learn it you still have to learn by doing. Which is unfortunate because otherwise Vince and Gordy would be throwing 150ft by now - and that would be cool :cool:

However where it becomes interesting is often the things we use to reinforce our casts and teach are actually wrong. Either it transpires that we are doing something differently to what we think we are doing (double haul is a great example - 20 years ago it was commonly believed that the haul loaded the rod and it was fully bent at the end of the haul), which gives us the opportunity to improve what we do. And in terms of teaching it allows us to find alternative explanations that are correct physics and yet still enable us to teach the feel of it.

Sometimes it’s a little bit unfortunate that the physicists find it so complicated that they need to have personal conflicts between themselves about stuff that quite frankly the rest of us don’t understand. There is no question that this prevents correct physics being used by instructors because, well it’s no fun and mostly it’s completely unintelligible anyway. But it’s our job to keep them on the straight and narrow producing results that they can agree upon and we can understand. That happens about once every 15 years :p (only joking t happens far more than that :D )

Cheers, Paul
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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#126  Postby VGB » Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:03 am

Hi Paul

Instructors don’t need physics to teach any more than competitors need to understand physics to cast. In my opinion, the physics has gained an unnecessary level of attention that distracts from other areas such as teaching methods. I often hear instructors talk about energy, tension and momentum, mostly incorrectly, it adds little value to what they are doing and makes me cringe.

As we have discussed before, the physicists do agree the principles of the cast and the instructing industry has got by perfectly well by learning by rote and snake oil for at least a century, it works. Technical analysis isn’t really essential but it does have a minority following and I think it is useful for fault finding. However, technical discussion needs to be kept to the Technical Analysis section because every thread is being hijacked to divert the discussion into modelling technobabble. This thread had far more value for instruction than any technical thread on this board but had few takers, you’ve got to wonder why :

viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2602

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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#127  Postby Paul Arden » Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:57 am

Ah but here is the rub - many instructors would like to be technically correct when it comes to the principles of the cast but find it difficult to determine what the information is when the engineers can’t even agree themselves :laugh: We’re all actually hoping that get to a point of agreement so you can explain it to us :).

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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#128  Postby VGB » Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:12 am

More than they need to know in a digestible format:

https://youtu.be/w6QuBKPS1x0
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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#129  Postby Paul Arden » Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:49 am

Ah yes and everyone agrees? :???:
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Double Haul timing

Post Number:#130  Postby VGB » Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:56 am

The physicists do

viewtopic.php?p=41341#p41341

I’m off fishing now, maybe someone will be able to teach me to spot grayling at 150ft and Lasse will find out how to adjust his haul timing by 0.07s.
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