Bernd's FP - Fly Fishing For Zander Line Set Up

[Nick]

Interesting discussion. I agree entirely with Bernd that feeling takes is much easier on lighter setups. It’s especially true when the fish is following the fly before taking it, all you might feel is slightly less tension because you no longer have the resistance caused by the fly.

The solution, as Bernd says, is to fish lighter gear, keep the line tight and set the hook as soon as you feel anything. However, I think this should be complemented by doing everything you can to make the fish hold on to the fly for as long as possible, so that you have the best chance to actually feel something. I think that’s why rubber baits are so effective, especially scented ones. Fish grab them and don’t immediately spit them out because they seem like the real thing.

It’s something that affects all kinds of fishing. What people fishing for salmon around here do to is that they use something called “egg yarn”. It’s a yarn with very fine fibers, which turns very fuzzy when it is cut. The theory is that the fish sucks in the lure, the yarn gets stuck on the fishes teeth and so it can’t spit it out. Might be worth trying for zander. They certainly have the teeth!

[Bernd Ziesche]

That might be an alternative solution? A bit backwards but a crease fly on a short Leader and a sinking line.

I have tested fast sinking lines (rate 5, 6 and rate 7) combined with short and very short (30cm) leaders and a floating fly. Exactly zero takes detected as long as I stripped very fast. The line never gets anywhere near straight enough for a medium or even slow retrieve.
Regards
Bernd

[Bernd Ziesche]

I think that’s why rubber baits are so effective, especially scented ones. Fish grab them and don’t immediately spit them out because they seem like the real thing.

It’s something that affects all kinds of fishing.

Hi Nick,
All these aspects are matching in all kinds of ff, agree. I have tested flavors on my flies for many weeks now. More about it in one of my next fps.
Regards
Bernd

[Richard]

Hi Bernd, (NB: this is not about Zander)

when I read your post on Wednesday, I knew I was going to fish on Sunday. The really exciting part was that thanks to Erik Hakkert and Warner Veldhuis, I got some great tips on how I could fish with thinner material and how an indicator made of yarn would help improve seeing takes over the floating device that I was using as indicator. So I ordered all these things and after reading your post, Sunday seemed to be infinitely far away. Especially, since I bought a #3 fishing line, instead of my regular #4, which I cheated with on my #3 rod, but made casting far more easy.

And then I woke up on Sunday. Rain pored down the windows, or was smashed against the windows to be more accurate, as the wind gushed down our house, leaving the swing in the garden in a steady 30 degree angle. It would be too much to go out for fishing... but then I remembered your post and my curiosity of 'light weight' fishing overcame my anxiety of storm entangled fishing line.

At the water the wind was horrible. My straight casts ended up at a 90 degree angle, even with a tilted angle and stops some 20 cm below the water. But hey, the line ended up in the water and I started stripping. And after a couple of tries I finally saw, what I heard others speak of, but never witnessed myself. While stripping the line in, the indicator seemed to stop, perhaps even slightly dragged backward, only than to be tucked under the surface. Perhaps this is the difference between 'take' and 'run' that I never noticed before. It happened not once, but multiple times and that afternoon I caught more fish on the spot I had been fishing for weeks. Moreover, they were also some of the biggest fish I caught, amongst others a really bulky 27cm bass.

Time will tell, whether the light weight setup or the extreme conditions were the result of more and bigger fish, but I like to think that your FP already provided the answer...

Cheers,
Richard

[Paul Arden]

..

[Richard]

haha, amazing!!!

[Michal Duzynski]

Hi Bernd
..again, not about zander, but...
Here in Australia when the tides are moving fast I,decided to use fast sinking lines( leviathan), also in the surf.
If not I would have the fly back under my feet in few secends.
Do you have any tips for fishing super fast sinking lines in fast water?
Cheers
Mike

[Paul Arden]

I have tested fast sinking lines (rate 5, 6 and rate 7) combined with short and very short (30cm) leaders and a floating fly. Exactly zero takes detected as long as I stripped very fast. The line never gets anywhere near straight enough for a medium or even slow retrieve.

I didn't know they wanted it stripped fast. That's a problem with the booby tactic generally because the fly can hook the bottom. Do you get to fish for them all year or are they a predominantly winter fish? I caught a few Walleye on the White River in Arkansas in the no-fishing area just below the dam in the dark. That was great fun, because of the fog/mist. You can't see more than about twenty feet and you only know where you are because of the direction of the flow. I was fishing with Walter at the time - may have been the first time I met Walter in fact. But I didn't see him all session - I heard him occasionally but that was it.

Cheers, Paul

[Bernd Ziesche]

The really exciting part was that thanks to Erik Hakkert and Warner Veldhuis, I got some great tips on how I could fish with thinner material and how an indicator made of yarn would help improve seeing takes over the floating device that I was using as indicator.

Hi Richard,
that's bery intersting stuff for sure!
I have tested a strike indicator for pike fishing after I realized, that I mostly miss the take (unless I fish totally calm conditions). The strike indicator did prove me to be spot-on several times!
I wanted to use on on Zander as well, but a water depth of 4 to 5m makes it tough.
Any more shallow and a strike indicator indeed shows a lot of unfelt takes way before we may then feel the fish running off significant after having taken our fly.
Thanks a lot for sharing your thoughts and your fine feedback!
Regards
Bernd

[Bernd Ziesche]

I have tested fast sinking lines (rate 5, 6 and rate 7) combined with short and very short (30cm) leaders and a floating fly. Exactly zero takes detected as long as I stripped very fast. The line never gets anywhere near straight enough for a medium or even slow retrieve.

I didn't know they wanted it stripped fast. That's a problem with the booby tactic generally because the fly can hook the bottom. Do you get to fish for them all year or are they a predominantly winter fish? I caught a few Walleye on the White River in Arkansas in the no-fishing area just below the dam in the dark. That was great fun, because of the fog/mist. You can't see more than about twenty feet and you only know where you are because of the direction of the flow. I was fishing with Walter at the time - may have been the first time I met Walter in fact. But I didn't see him all session - I heard him occasionally but that was it.

Mate, it's not the fish wanting my fly to being moved fast. In fact it's opposite. BUT stripping slowly here means to much slack making it impossible to feel the take. Thus my only chance was in the fish not spitting the fly but holding it and running off. Something which my winer Zander won't do in 99%. Fast stripping = I pull out the slack much fast and may have a chance to set the hook before the Zander spits it out. Still this outfit doesn't work well for sure. In summertime I can strip faster though and then this outfit may bring some percentage. But only some, that I am sure about.
In Sea trout fishing I have learnt, that we miss more takes compared to how much we realize. Our slack, line mass, line surface (friction) and stretch dampen too many takes. The big chance is in a fast retrieve here. That I have been proven for almost 20 years. Slow retrieve always lost when it came to the number of catches.
Regards
B