Gabby hand casting

[whinging pom]

Due to casters elbow( I refuse to bring racket and club hobbies into this)
I find I’m restricted to practicing wrong- uns on the left side. And surprisingly all good, crisp and accurate with left handed satanist casting ….,,,,until double hauling! And find my beloved right is Sh*t useless at the simple task. No worries I thought…. I was confident that triangle method would sort this in a session, but no!

Any one of you teachers/ instructors have a drill to train my trusty right hand into a hauling machine.
Thanks in anticipation of enlightenment
The Pom

[Mangrove Cuckoo]

Pom,

Funny thing... isn't it?

Most everyone, at first, thinks they won't be able to cast left handed very well. But then they find that they actually can, and much better than they expected. In fact, I've had numerous students who had serious problems with their right (dominant) hand casting due to years of practicing their errors (who reluctantly agree to try casting left handed), and were amazed that the error was gone when they cast with their left.

And, as I think you are now experiencing, they are then shocked at how retarded their right hand is when it comes to hauling!

It is completely the opposite of what everyone expects... myself included.

I wish I had a quick fix to pull out of my hat and wow you with my knowledge, but I don't. But I can offer some suspicions...

I think it has a lot to do with communication between the brain and the hands, and which hand leads while the other follows.

I have on numerous occasions gotten the student to take control of their dominant hand, which is casting poorly and unconsciously, by having them switch hands. In the first case, the dominant hand is not paying attention to what the caster (brain) wants. There are often years of experience and the unconscious hand almost refuses to pay attention. But, when the rod is switched to the non-dominant hand, that hand has no experience and has to get instruction from the brain. Communication channels are required to be open. Then after just a few casts, if the rod is then placed back in the dominant hand, almost miraculously, the caster can then somewhat control that previously aloof hand.

But when it comes to hauling, it seems to be quite different! You would think the right hand would be much quicker at learning to haul since it is the "smarter" hand. But, it seems as if teaching that hand to haul is much, much more difficult. Once again, I think it has to do with something about communication. In this case, it seems that hands have a preferred leader/follower routine. Asking the right hand to follow, when all of one's life it was the leader is really changing the program!

One suggestion I can make is to sort of switch your thought process. Most folks consider the rod hand to be the main player, and the haul to only add a smaller percentage of energy to the cast. It is quite possible to switch that up... only move the rod through the motions, but try to add the majority of the energy by hauling. That way the right hand, even though it is the hauling hand, is still the "leader".

Also, maybe try to cast with the left foot forward. That positions the body to allow a very full movement of the (right) hauling hand. So, try to use a very long haul with emphasis on the final acceleration well behind and below the body... letting the right hand haul dominate the cast.

Keep at it! It is amazing how fast you will improve if you just keep trying.

[Paul Arden]

Can you still use your right hand for single casts? If so the best exercise that worked for me was to make backcast with right hand, hauling left hand and place the line on the ground. Switch hands. Backcast with left hand, hauling right hand and place line on ground. Repeat very many times.

Then switch to forward casts only. Same process, singular casts swapping hands after each cast. Line on the ground.

Then make singular PUALDs one side then the other – do this many times – and then finally build up to false casting.

This above process will need to be repeated many times. However it gives the bonus that you get to inspect your original right hand casting left hand hauling to a level that you probably haven’t done before.

Hopefully your left hand hauling is effective because your right hand hauling will end up mirroring it

Cheers, Paul

[Graeme H]

The big thing for me was replicating the lateness of the haul when I started trying to haul with my right (dominant) hand. I'd suggest you persevere but concentrate on that by watching your hands while you cast. Delay the haul as long as you can (or dare). It'll come, but the timing is the thing to work on.

The fact that you (and others) struggle to haul with the dominant hand is a great lesson for students who claim they are "strongly dominant" with one hand. The haul with that hand shows them that every skill we do is based on training rather than natural talent. Hauling seems simpler than casting, and yet we all initially struggle with it on the non-dominant hand.

Conversely, many struggle to overcome learnt skills when trying to go from spinning rods to fly gear, relying on the wrist for the majority of the casting action. Switching to the non-dominant hand reduces the reliance on the wrist for the cast (for most people) and they get closer to a fly casting action with little thought.

Cheers,
Graeme

[whinging pom]

The big thing for me was replicating the lateness of the haul
Cheers,
Graeme

that had me in hysterics! timing?!!! i just wish I could bloody haul!

Really interesting set of replies chaps thankyou,
I've had a long day on site and huge drive home im bushed! but will look forward to going through your wonderful advice in the morning.

Thinking about it after i posted. I spent along time learning to cast with the right and getting it feeling second nature before learning the double haul much later. At the moment im engaged/ mindful of the mechanics of left hand casting so bringing the right in so soon is probably ambitious.
So im looking forward to ready your replies again over a good strong coffee in the morning when i can digest them properly
thanks again MC paul and Graeme H for the helpful advice and thoughtful replies
all best
WP

[Paul Arden]

To play with the haul timing use the triangle set-up (or the way I suggest above) and start the haul as the rod butt passes the centre line or even later. As Graeme suggests, watch your hands! This singular casting from ground to ground, allows you to slow everything down and break down parts of the stroke.

Trying to make these adjustments while false casting with the line in the air is very difficult.

As far as learning the haul goes, like you I took a long time to actually learn it. I had like most self-taught anglers already formed a back haul of sorts on my own, no or little line hand up movement, and then more of a stab than a haul on the front cast. So it took me 15 years before I learned to make an effective Double Haul. This is of course a disadvantage of being self-taught because with completely new students I can normally teach the Double Haul after 1-3hrs. I know that would have made a huge difference to those 15 years of fly fishing for me!

Cheers, Paul

[whinging pom]

I find it interesting what MC says about the communication between the brain and hand and which dominates, and Graeme’s distraction when re- learning.

Theres many tasks I rely on with my right that by necessity I’ve had to tell my left just to do it “Come on you’ve got an opposable thumb, your designed to do this !”… usually up ladders doing thorny old roses, using secateurs ( having to adjust the grip to get a smooth by-pass) one handed tying in of stems. Swinging a hammer without missing the nail half hanging off the ladder. I just gee myself up and the little trier usually comes good. I’ve even got my topiary skills down to both hands with small hand shears, a regular Edward Scissor hands! I’ve always been slightly smug that I’m leaning towards ambidextrous at very least.


So my right I assumed would be equally adaptable if not more. But instead of talking to the hand, this time the hand seems to be answering back… “Hauling?! …get ****ed. That’s below me!”

So based on your words I need to trick it into being the dominant movement and follow with the casting hand I guess.

Swapping hands is a great way of reviewing the actions/mechanics from a slightly shifted perspective isn’t it ?!! ( much like teaching I guess).

Paul it looks like your leading me back to the triangle, which was what my initial instinct was, I’ll give myself more time with it and break it down.

Up in old Blighty the clocks have gone back and the day fades away from usable light around four now. So grabbing a leisurely hour or two of practice after work is now realistically a grabbed 15minutes if it’s not raining and rushing it in before the light goes. I’m probably not giving it chance to settle and thus walking away from the field in the growing gloom feeling beaten is not ideal.

Il get down there later with more time and all your words to read and the various suggestions to try and I’ll beat this.
Thanks all for the thoughtful answers and guidance.
Pom

[VGB]

The big thing for me was replicating the lateness of the haul when I started trying to haul with my right (dominant) hand. I'd suggest you persevere but concentrate on that by watching your hands while you cast. Delay the haul as long as you can (or dare). It'll come, but the timing is the thing to work on.

Wot Graeme says. As a leftie and very ambidextrous, I thought it would be a doddle but I have to work at it. I'm casting about 70ft cack handed with a 5wt set up but there's still a lot of conscious thought going on when I am doing it. I got there 1ft at a time and am still improving.

IMO the issue with hauling is related to our default motions, hand clapping, walking and the like come to us relatively easily. For most of the population carrying out limb movements in phase or anti phase is a prevalent human behavioural tendency and there's lots of science underpinning that statement. Conducting arrhythmic motion such as hauling, rubbing your tummy/patting your head are learned skills, most people aren't able to move their hands with a 90 degree phase relationship. People such as drummers would probably haul much quicker than average because they practice these arrhythmic hand movements.

[Paul Arden]

IMO hauling IS the dominant factor. And that’s the problem. One we have learned to haul effectively with the left hand (right handers) then the haul controls the cast, timing and so on. When we switch to right hand hauling this takes time. We are told it’s another side of the brain that need to be trained.

The haul is not an add-on to the stoke. It dominates it.

Cheers, Paul

[VGB]

So once you are a proficient caster, your non dominant hand is driving? Y’all really want to be left handed