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Stop and SLP discussion
Moderators: Paul Arden, Bernd Ziesche, Lasse Karlsson
- Paul Arden
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
I think smell is underrated.
Re: Stop and SLP discussion
There are some fishermen that put a peg on their nose, to increase their feel
“Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius — and a lot of courage — to move in the opposite direction.” — Ernst F. Schumacher
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
You've spend too long without washing your socks dude....
Your friendly neighbourhood flyslinger
Flycasting, so simple that instructors need to make it complicated since 1685
Got a Q++ at casting school, wearing shorts
Flycasting, so simple that instructors need to make it complicated since 1685
Got a Q++ at casting school, wearing shorts
- Bernd Ziesche
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
Hi Vince,
Oh, btw. many years ago, Lasse's wife Silja announced (in a forum) a 3h lesson on shooting head casting including to learn the double haul for beginners. Several experienced instructors claimed it to be ridiculous and impossible trying to teach a beginner the dh within the first 3 hours. I didn't jump into that, but send Silja a friendly email offering my similuar opinion, that this was expecting a lot or too much for a beginner.
I couldn't have been more wrong. I learnt my lesson from that my mistake.
That aside, you probably meant to say, that I did miss the point why you linked that video (which imo has nothing to do with what that video and the paralympics are about).
So this was the point you wanted to make:
Cheers
Bernd
I don't think so. Here's what those who made that video said:
Our mission is to lead the Paralympic Movement, oversee the delivery of the Paralympic Games and support members to enable Para athletes to achieve sporting excellence.
What I said::Jerome Avery inspires athletes and individuals impacted by disabilities to overcome adversity and see endless possibilities - both on and off of the track or field.
Exactly how I see it. Why telling disabled students what they can't do before the even have entered the lesson? I prefer to believe they can do more then I may expect. I don't understand my job in limiting their path by thinking about their limits. I feel precisely the opposite. My experience is, that disabeled students usually already have enough people telling them what they can't do anyway.Bernd Ziesche wrote: So why shouldn't someone blind become a proper caster, too. Still he might surprise us all.
Oh, btw. many years ago, Lasse's wife Silja announced (in a forum) a 3h lesson on shooting head casting including to learn the double haul for beginners. Several experienced instructors claimed it to be ridiculous and impossible trying to teach a beginner the dh within the first 3 hours. I didn't jump into that, but send Silja a friendly email offering my similuar opinion, that this was expecting a lot or too much for a beginner.
I couldn't have been more wrong. I learnt my lesson from that my mistake.
That aside, you probably meant to say, that I did miss the point why you linked that video (which imo has nothing to do with what that video and the paralympics are about).
So this was the point you wanted to make:
I still don't see the point in this, because my students don't aim to participate or even win the WC. They just want to enjoy fishing. I have zero doubt, that blind people can fly fish, too. Castingwise I am sure they would make some good casters, too. You could also link videos presenting ppl. in a wheelchair within their limits. And yes, they too won't win the WC in distance fly casting. But I have seen them learn to cast quickly and who knows one may become an outstanding accuracy caster.VGB wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2024 6:37 am A 100m straight line sprint is a highly repetitive, low variability task. However the best unsighted sprinter in the world still needs assistance with it because his proprioceptive sense is not accurate enough for him to complete the task without significant errors. Without the continuous feedback of his guide, he would wander out of his lane.
I have no clue why I would let anyone start to cast without teaching him to adjust line length first. Very easy task. If that's what you'd do, maybe I should look for someone supporting me in my needs (no offense intended). That imo would be to have me start with a proper length of line. No different with students who have sight. I tell them what line length to start with. And not just that, in a group lesson I need to be able to figure or know how much line everyone is casting from a distance. So I may put marks!
Those students I had sitting in a wheelchair could not aim for 100m sprints, but they did just fine in fly casting.
I have a pretty different view on this. Just like fish, too we sometimes use one, sometimes a mix of several senses. But it is done for proper reason, that athletes (and by far not only athletes) at times shut down/block senses to support using the one, which matters most within a task. Of course this doesn't mean, that we don't have proper use for all senses in our lives.
Cheers
Bernd
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The first cast is always the best cast.
The first cast is always the best cast.
- Bernd Ziesche
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
Mark,Stoatstail50 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2024 4:42 pm The point being, still, that it is highly personal, totally subjective. I can't explain in any unambiguous, communicable way what it is that I "feel".
You won't believe, mate but I am afraid, I have no clue why on earth green is and always was my favorite color. So what does that say about using sight in teaching?
Btw. do you ask students, if they can see colors, to make sure they at least see the world similuar to you?
I sure never thought of it and never asked!
Regards
B
http://www.first-cast.de
The first cast is always the best cast.
The first cast is always the best cast.
- Bernd Ziesche
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
Fly fishermen indeed comletely failed to study how fish use their sense of smell. Most also failed to at least learn this from other angler's knowledge.
http://www.first-cast.de
The first cast is always the best cast.
The first cast is always the best cast.
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
Nothing.So what does that say about using sight in teaching?
I don’t…but I would if they were painting my front door.Btw. do you ask students, if they can see colors, to make sure they at least see the world similuar to you?
Casting Definitions
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
- Bernd Ziesche
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
Nothing... exactly my point. No different for what you said about feel!
You and Vince have put in quite some effort about looking into other sports like golf, baseball when it comes to how to teach.
You may have a look into this:
Seems feel matters a lot to those golf experts.
You and Vince have put in quite some effort about looking into other sports like golf, baseball when it comes to how to teach.
You may have a look into this:
Seems feel matters a lot to those golf experts.
http://www.first-cast.de
The first cast is always the best cast.
The first cast is always the best cast.
Re: Stop and SLP discussion
You did BerndBernd Ziesche wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2024 8:07 pm Hi Vince,I don't think so. Here's what those who made that video said:
Here’s what David Brown said himself:
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/08/31/spor ... index.html
RegardsHe raced in 600 and 60-meter events with the track team at the Missouri School for the Blind in St. Louis – gripping a clothesline-like wire that ran alongside the track for assistance – and from there gradually transitioned to running with a guide.
“I was in very big denial of my sight, which is one thing, so there were times when I would run and I didn’t run with a guide because I thought I could see,” Brown says. He was diagnosed with Kawasaki disease at 15 months old, which resulted in glaucoma and ultimately losing his sight years later.
Brown continues: “I was able to see well enough to not necessarily stay in my lanes when I was racing, but I was able to see well enough to stay on the track.
Vince
“Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius — and a lot of courage — to move in the opposite direction.” — Ernst F. Schumacher
https://www.sexyloops.com/index.php/ps/ ... f-coaching
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Re: Stop and SLP discussion
Hi Bernd
I’m watching rugby. Is there any particular thing you want me to look at in the golf video?
Regards
Vince
The point is that fishing is a high variability task, almost diametrically opposed to 100m sprints. Do you think it’s easier to sit on a production line doing the same thing over and over again, or come up with a different solution when there’s a continually changing task and environment, like fishing?Bernd Ziesche wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2024 8:07 pm
So this was the point you wanted to make:I still don't see the point in this, because my students don't aim to participate or even win the WC. They just want to enjoy fishing.VGB wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2024 6:37 am A 100m straight line sprint is a highly repetitive, low variability task. However the best unsighted sprinter in the world still needs assistance with it because his proprioceptive sense is not accurate enough for him to complete the task without significant errors. Without the continuous feedback of his guide, he would wander out of his lane.
I’m watching rugby. Is there any particular thing you want me to look at in the golf video?
Regards
Vince
“Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius — and a lot of courage — to move in the opposite direction.” — Ernst F. Schumacher
https://www.sexyloops.com/index.php/ps/ ... f-coaching
https://www.sexyloops.com/index.php/ps/ ... f-coaching