PLEASE NOTE: In order to post on the Board you need to have registered. To register please email paul@sexyloops.com including your real name and username. Registration takes less than 24hrs, unless Paul is fishing deep in the jungle!
I'm unsure about different lines in the wind. I know I often pray to just straighten everything out when casting into the wind, so I don't shoot much, if any. So I would guess the head length should about match how long you are commonly trying to reach?
Wind from the side might be a completely different story?
“Pray to just straighten everything out” is a constant struggle especially on my BC. Shorter casts not so hard it’s when I’m starting to carry 60+’ is when things begin going awry
George sums it up it perfectly with James’ understanding I think. So they will feel quite different. Imagine the same mass but condensed into a bubble float, or lead weight, at one extreme, compared to a very light and long DT of the same total mass. That’s going to feel very different (the DT will feel much lighter, even though it’s the same total mass).
You can also consider how the mass is distributed in a line. Instead of a DT, take a triangle taper and a “front loaded” taper that we see in many lines (which is sort of reversed TT). These behave quite differently. Lee’s two unrolling heads at the same time video shows this.
IMO we are not casting the rod, we are casting the line. Different line taper and mass distributions, over different lengths, will feel and behave quite differently. That’s going to have an effect on how the rod bends; place all the weight next to the rod tip and the rod will flex more than if we spread the mass over a very long thin line, or indeed just further away from the tip.
And then we can throw different rod stiffnesses and actions into this mix. There is a great deal of variety. Lines are different, rods are different. It makes sense that we prefer certain combinations over others. I don’t like tomatoes in salad, but I like them in pasta sauce. I like butterscotch ice cream and I love blue cheese, but not together. (Actually I’ve never tried that. It could be good). And that’s sort of the point; we are matching two variables, often to cope with a range of desired outcomes.
IMO we are not casting the rod, we are casting the line. Different line taper and mass distributions, over different lengths, will feel and behave quite differently. That’s going to have an effect on how the rod bends; place all the weight next to the rod tip and the rod will flex more than if we spread the mass over a very long thin line, or indeed just further away from the tip.
Cheers, Paul
Rods bend because we, the casters, apply a force to the bottom of them. Thats why they bend butt first.
And the line exits the tip, if the weight is at our disposal, it doesnt matter if its right next to the tip, or spread out over 25 meters in a straight line.
That casters prefer short weights to long weights is a given, its alot harder to have a long weight positioned right, than to get a short one in the right place. Has nothing really to do with the rod, everything to do with the caster
Cheers
Lasse
Your friendly neighbourhood flyslinger
Flycasting, so simple that instructors need to make it complicated since 1685
Lasse Karlsson wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 10:16 am
That casters prefer short weights to long weights is a given, its alot harder to have a long weight positioned right, than to get a short one in the right place. Has nothing really to do with the rod, everything to do with the caster
Cheers
Lasse
Lasse
So is this why I find any rod/line combo I use more let’s say “user friendly” when using a -40 foot head vs. a +50’ head in the wind?
I suspect 99% of the guys casting a fly rod have no concept of the need to get the line ‘positioned right’, nor even what ‘right’ entails. It is just not emphasized (at least from what I’ve seen/read) as an essential concept. It seems, rather, that instruction is aimed at making it happen indirectly without the caster realizing it is a major determinant of what is to follow.
I should qualify the above before Lasse sets me straight.
With proper acceleration and careful power application a poor line position can be overcome. I recall Aitor’s video of avoiding a tail with a steeple cast or easterncasters video of throwing laser straight fly legs with a roll cast.
For most of us hacks, however, such refined power application is a pipe dream in which case getting the line in the best position to make a good cast happen is crucial.
Aitor’s video of avoiding the tail (or depending on definitions, extreme dangling end) was possible because he allowed the line to fall into place, creating a waypoint. There are three ways. One is to do that, the other is to cast it there using trajectories and the third is to make a Belgian Cast.
Rod bend is affected by the force at the tip as well as at the butt. At one extreme you can anchor the rod tip and at the other cast without a line/weight. Mass being pulled by the rod tip will retard the rod tip causing the rod to flex deeper. Newton discovered this when casting apples. Or perhaps it was Hooke?
Paul Arden wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2024 1:02 pm
Aitor’s video of avoiding the tail (or depending on definitions, extreme dangling end) was possible because he allowed the line to fall into place, creating a waypoint.
Cheers, Paul
Another interesting topic.
Aren’t waypoints created by both a change in direction and continued acceleration? In Aitor’s case he needs to match the acceleration he is producing towards target to the acceleration of gravity. The latter is quite smooth indeed and Aitor’s ability to match it is impressive.
Anyways, my experience is that smooth acceleration over a long straight path goes a long way towards minimizing the effects of suboptimal line position…….but since smooth, straight, and long acceleration is difficult for us peons, positioning the line correctly before attempting it is very useful. Or is this naive?
Thanks
George
I’ll have to think about that but I don’t see why it has to match gravity. The line comes around the corner and it’s all subject to gravity. You can do the same thing in the horizontal plane; for example false cast horizontal to the bank and change direction across the river on the delivery. I never considered it a waypoint until it was pointed out of course.
Putting the line into the preferred position on the backcast I think is the best option. Particularly when the line length outside the rod tip is longer than tip travel.
let’s say “user friendly” when using a -40 foot head vs. a +50’ head in the wind?