The BIG THREE

[VGB]

[Lasse Karlsson]

Vince, aren't most people nerds??

But good to see that flyfishers are of the chart

Cheers
Lasse

[Unregistered]

Vince,
That is the maximum level of complexity that should be allowed for graphs in this section.
Even I can understand it.

[Will]

If we are having pictures, does that mean we can have graphs?

Seriously, I do like the graphic but would suggest "appropriate tension" to achieve "the cast I want"

regards

Vince

IANACI

Hi Vince, great graph. It appears that I am more satisfied than a normal person of my age, but I have yet to achieve the peak satisfaction that he/she achieved earlier in life. It seems it's now just about me (a) preserving nerd-dom, and (b) hanging on to life as long as possible.

Re: "appropriate". Yes I agree, you prob. need that word in front of everything below "The Cast I Want".

"keeping the rod in plane" is what I want my students to do while shaping an open loop. So it would not have to be part of SLP. It also doesn't have to refer to tracking.

Bernd,
That's why I didn't use SLP - I just used "Tip Path" (Following Vince's comment read "Appropriate Tip Path"). Keeping the rod in plane (or not), and tracking (or not), are direct inputs that are aimed at achieving an intended/appropriate tip path. I think of the other four as being foundational (indirect) inputs supporting the intended/appropriate tip path.

To be clear, in demos and explanations to students, I start at the top of the house and work down!

W.

[Bernd Ziesche]

That makes sense, Will. Same as I do.

Nice graph, Vince

[Malik]

Hi Bernd, Hi Will,

Bernd, I like very much your big three ! Will thank you for your great diagram !

It was mentioned by you both that a late rotation is an essential for a tight loop. Why ?

I think that the timing of the rotation is a “variant”, connected to the intended distance of the cast.

(I ask the question because, in my style, for cast at short and average distances, it is the opposite which is true — the idea being that, on this type of cast, more the rotation is anticipated, more you have the space to “compensate” it with the thrust and the follow through)

Thank you for your answers guys

Cheers

Malik

[Will]

Interesting comment Malik.

I agree that for shortish casts you can rotate throughout the stroke.

However with beginners, at all distances, you see early rotation leading to open loops. If the rod rotates before it is bent it is very likely that the rod tip will rise thereby starting a concave tip path from the start of the stroke. I guess this could be reduced by dropping the hand as rotation starts, but that may limit distance eventually.

This is most noticeable when teaching roll casts.

It would be great if you could post some video of your style, it'd be interesting to see what you're doing.

Cheers

Will

[Malik]

Thank you for your answer Will !

Considering this answer, with which I agree in a large part, do you not believe that the other formulation "rotation at the right time", which is also proposed by Bernd in his post number —  which number by the way ? * — is better than "rotate late", even if more vague and less prescriptive ?

I would not go so far as to say: " short cast/short stroke/"anticipated" rotation — long cast/long stroke/late rotation" but I reflect about it. Work in progress...

You find some movies here : http://vimeo.com/simfly ("Anatomy of a thrust " illustrates well enough what I try to say)

Best regards

Malik

* It is useful to be able to refer to the numbers of the post, as on the old SL

[Will]

Considering this answer, with which I agree in a large part, do you not believe that the other formulation "rotation at the right time", which is also proposed by Bernd in his post number —  which number by the way ? * — is better than "rotate late", even if more vague and less prescriptive ?

Yep, that's OK. A bit like Vince's "appropriate". That's why I just put "rotation" on the diagram.

Cheers

W.

[Malik]

Yep, that's OK. A bit like Vince's "appropriate". That's why I just put "rotation" on the diagram.

Cheers

W.

... which I find, once again, very useful; thank's Will

Malik