Fly Line for beginners?

[andrewparkeruk]

Big name brand flylines are too expensive to get wrong. At the prices now asked, companies such as RIO, SA/Orvis, Loop should provide free to tackle shops sample lines in weights so that customers can try out options.

A few years ago I worked out that for my UK river Trout/Grayling fishing it would work out cheaper to settle on a flyline, then take that with me to shops or shows to find the magic rod

Andrew

[Tangled]

Maxcatch do a range of lines that are straight RIO rip offs, cost very little but are also very good. The Maxcatch Real Gold is the same profile as the RIO Gold. It's half a line overweight with a 45' head. I bought one out of curiosity and to practice with but I now fish with it. It cost £12.50! They have even cheaper lines which people say are also very good.

[Lasse Karlsson]

Blimey I would have to work a lot of hours to be a millionaire at my current rate! Definitely far too much work for me

Every beginners set I have come across, have got a short headed line that is slightly to heavily overweight, why is that?

Why are they overweight? Compared to AFFTA? Then it could be because the rods are too stiff. Of maybe the manufacturers expect beginners to be fishing bigger flies and stronger tippets than everyone else?

I realise that our views tend to be skewed by where we fish and you fish the Danish imaginary salt, Lasse, where covering large amounts of water is required. That’s quite a niche problem and it’s no surprise that most use shooting heads.

In my opinion the biggest single fault in fly fishing, both rivers and Stillwaters, is attempting to fish at too great a distance. There are exceptions of course - reservoir banks and when you need significant depth off a boat - but, for most of the time, anglers are lining the water they should be fishing and frequently pickup to recast before the flies have even reached the water that they should have been fishing in the first place.

Many of the WF lines on the market nowadays are really integrated shooting heads. 1-2 weighs up (sometimes more), short head, thin running line (as opposed to shooting line). Well that’s fine and dandy if all you need is distance. But it’s a bit daft to use a shooting head for fishing short to medium range, say while nymphing a stream or fishing loch style in front of a drifting boat.

So as I wrote in my first reply I believe the right recommendation has to do with the type of fishing that is to be done. Fortunately there is much more to fly fishing than monotonous lure bashing!

Cheers, Paul

Sorry dude, didn't see your reply

They are overweight, compared to the AFFTA number they sport, and it's not because the rods are stiff, come on, we both know thats a red herring but because a crappy cast will still direct enough mass towards a target for the line to go somewhere, and alot are told that that is what they should feel... it's the same reason many go up a linesize when rollcasting in tight little confined spaces.

Yeah I fish the imaginary salt, and use gear most think is completly wrong, so I tend to not use myself as a guide here I also fish rivers lakes and sea. We haven't got much large stillwater fishing though, thats a niche sport if there ever where one here I do agree that most try to cast far when they should ve casting short

And just because something says "distance" when you look at it, it might actually work fine for short work too, don't we teach a variable casting arc/angle as some of the first stuff?

It always goes, or should at least, fly, line to deliver it, and then pick a stick to wave it around. The better you are, the lighter a line you can get away with, the worse you are, the more help you need... and since most flyfishers are men, won't practice, won't take a lesson from someone who knows which end of the aforementioned stick they should hold on to, and would rather rely on advice from their peers and from people who want to sell them gear, we end up where we are...

And yes, we agree completly in choosing gear to match the fishing! Fortunatly there's also euro nymphing

Cheers
Lasse

[Paul Arden]

Yeah we’re on the same page Lasse. I do think rod stiffness and feel has something to do with it however! Especially for those taught to cast 10-2!! Carbon Fibre rods have massively changed over the years. When they first appeared one could flex them butt to tip. That’s still possible sometimes but mostly not! When Sage started to appear in the UK they were commonly over-lined by one line rating. Rods that nowadays we think of as soft, were being over-lined 30 years ago – because they were too stiff for the British market!

Funnily enough I think many modern and especially “SW” rods are too stiff. I’m also convinced that FG has made a comeback simply because many anglers have never cast a CF rod that has plenty of flex. Carbon rods can have a very similar action and feel to Fibreglass, and most did when I first started fly fishing. The difference was what happens immediately up to and after RSP and that was why rod makers much preferred CF.

Cheers, Paul

[andrewparkeruk]

Yeah we’re on the same page Lasse. I do think rod stiffness and feel has something to do with it however! Especially for those taught to cast 10-2!! Carbon Fibre rods have massively changed over the years. When they first appeared one could flex them butt to tip. That’s still possible sometimes but mostly not! When Sage started to appear in the UK they were commonly over-lined by one line rating. Rods that nowadays we think of as soft, were being over-lined 30 years ago – because they were too stiff for the British market!

Funnily enough I think many modern and especially “SW” rods are too stiff. I’m also convinced that FG has made a comeback simply because many anglers have never cast a CF rod that has plenty of flex. Carbon rods can have a very similar action and feel to Fibreglass, and most did when I first started fly fishing. The difference was what happens immediately up to and after RSP and that was why rod makers much preferred CF.

Cheers, Paul

… where is @Ben_d when you need someone to say: “Whangey noodle shit”?

[Paul Arden]

I haven’t heard from Ben for yonks. Shame to hear that Maxcatch is ripping off RÍO. I can’t see that working long term.

Cheers, Paul

[Lasse Karlsson]

Hi Paul

Oh, I do think rod stiffness and feel are linked, no doubt about it, but largely what one sgould feel for is dine wrong, stiff rods offer tons of feel and feedback, but one needs to know what to feel for and how. The old feel the rod loading, when what people then really feel is the kickback of counterflex isn't really what obe sgould look for

Yeah, same here in Scandinavia, sage are too stiff, overline by at least one weight. But back then lines where more often than not true to AFFTA... today its everything should be overlined from the get go, and ecen when the manufacturers come with a line two classes over, its sgould also be one more over at least then again, the british market 30 years ago had the Bruce and walker hexagraph rods as top of the line, didn't they

Yeah, especially the higher number SW rods seem to fall in that category, not so sure GF was because most haven't tried a CF that flexes, more to do with nostalgia and marketing..

And yup, sad to see that kind of copying, has been going on for years though, it's more sad to see the hype about supporting it though!

Cheers
Lasse

[Paul Arden]

I was in Rutland fishing lodge about 10 years ago and I noticed WJ and Fishpond gear, but one row of stitches instead of two and poor quality material. Same colours however and just a blatant rip-off. barstool!

[daniel]

I'm pretty sure when i was sold a 9'6" 7wt XP a million years ago, i was told i'd need an 8 line to load it, may have been a 444sl or possibly Wulff TT. Rod was way beyond my skill level but it actually made me want to learn how to cast, and led me to Sexyloops. Over 20 yrs later i'm still here

Havent cast an XP in quite a while but id probably think it soft now.

[Lasse Karlsson]

Just stick a 6 or 5 weight on it

Cheers
Lasse