The problem with lines

[Paul Arden]

It’s difficult because the info is there. For example RÍO say on their site that their SW lines are mostly 1 line weight overweight. And all line weights are listed in their site. I find the situation quite bizarre. It’s like taking a bowling ball to a ping pong match. RÍO are obviously trying to help because anglers are buying rods that are too stiff for them. But what I find truly quite odd in this situation is that the same business that owns RÍO also owns Sage. So I imagine it’s actually done for a reason.

Maybe it’s so ultimately you can pretend you are taking a 3WT Tarpon fishing. Me thinks it’s like women’s clothing possibly.

Cheers, Paul

[nicholasfmoore]

Hi Paul,

A video is a very good idea Nick. It will certainly save my fingers. What surprised me here was not the misunderstanding itself but it being a misunderstanding by an instructor.

I suppose there are nowadays a large number of casters who have never cast a DT. Or even cast a true to weight line

It would be great if you made one, as you are well respected in the industry, and people will listen to you After all, SL is the best website for casting.

Do you think DT will phase out? After all, manufacturers sell way more WF lines than DT.

This video is interesting, it's long though, 1hr 20 odd, but AFFTA discussion is from 18:39 - 24:56



I do think the vast majority of anglers would be better off with a soft Hardy, Greys, Winston etc and a true to weight line. A few anglers have wanted to try my sage igniter #6, and with a true to weight line (thunderbolt) they say that they can't feel anything, bad timing and slack is often present etc. But in general, things that are lighter and faster are often viewed as better, which is why they buy a stiffer and faster rod, maybe.

I still think it's a misunderstanding about casting, a heavier line to 'load faster action rods' is often quoted (10-2 and the big spring myth for example). As James says, people will rave about lines when they go far, but as we know, throwing lighter lines requires very good technique.

It takes effort to practice, and most anglers just want to catch fish. Some don't practice because they don't want to, and some don't practice because they really don't know how.

Maybe it’s so ultimately you can pretend you are taking a 3WT Tarpon fishing

I agree!

I do think you need to do a nice video presentation on it, Paul. It would be of great benefit to everyone.

All the best

[James9118]

It’s difficult because the info is there. For example RÍO say on their site that their SW lines are mostly 1 line weight overweight. And all line weights are listed in their site.

Cheers, Paul

If they know exactly how much they weigh they should stop putting them in the wrong box then. It's clearly mis-labelling and grounds for the consumer to return the item. If they want to sell any line they should either put the correct AFFTA specification number on the box or leave it off altogether and describe the line as they wish i.e. head weight etc.

Cheers, James

[Lasse Karlsson]

Lets not forget that AFFTA is a voluntary standard, and most flyfishers don't give a damn about it
Heck, no intructor organisation gives a damn about it...

Cheers
Lasse

[James9118]

Lets not forget that AFFTA is a voluntary standard
Cheers
Lasse

That makes it even worse in my book - they're volunteering to get it wrong.

Cheers, James

[Lasse Karlsson]

[Boisker]

Hi chaps,

I had an interesting conversation tonight with a customer who was telling me with his style he would like a stiffer rod. Which of course is fine (but surprised me because we’ve cast together). I asked what lines he thought were right for the HT10 that he was using. He told me some 7 and 8 WTS. I did some research and the “7WT” line he was using weighed just over 9.5WT!! Ie closest to 10WT parameters.

Now I can understand all of this and he was surprised when I pointed out his seven weight line was actually nearest to 10WT.

However what may surprise you is that he is an instructor.

What I take from this is the AFFTA system will fail unless we (or AFFTA) go out of our way to educate everyone. We are not very far away from the days where rods and lines will need to be sold together as one package.

Cheers, Paul

Jeez..... if I’d paid that instructor for a lesson I would be wanting my money back.... that’s embarrassing....
Even as a none instructor I’ve been looking up the weight of a line for ages and the last couple of years paid far more attention to head and line tapers...
An instructor with such a gap in their knowledge is nearly as bad as a driving instructor not realising some cars take petrol, some diesel and some are electric

[nicholasfmoore]

[Paul Arden]

“Has the certificate”. He’s actually a very tidy caster. And ditto it surprised the hell out of me too that he didn’t know. BUT that’s the point! We know - on Sexyloops we’ve been discussing it for donkey’s years, but how many people have no idea? It made me reevaluate just how ingrained this heavier than AFFTA rating line bollocks has become.

Let’s get a page up on measuring lines and start to populate that database. Both SA and RÍO are very open with their target weights. SA sent me a table of all the line weights. With RÍO they are often exactly one AFFTA too heavy (this makes it easy to recommend their lines for me, I just recommend a lighter line box weight by one).

I think I now know why 7X is too fine for many people

Cheers, Paul

[nicholasfmoore]

Hi Paul,

Let’s get a page up on measuring lines and start to populate that database. Both SA and RÍO are very open with their target weights. SA sent me a table of all the line weights. With RÍO they are often exactly one AFFTA too heavy (this makes it easy to recommend their lines for me, I just recommend a lighter line box weight by one).

What standard equipment would you recommend? I'd be happy to write it. Everyone would need some vernier calipers to find where the end of the level tip section is. Scales to .1 of a grain too?

All the best!