Stopping the rod - tuition required

[James9118]

Having been following the 'Tuition Styles' thread it seems to me that a practical example may help add something in terms of different tuition styles from different instructors (or coaches). The following is a very real example that is causing me some frustration:

I'd like to teach someone (let's call her 'Stacey' to keep things anonymous ) to perform a very aggressive stop with a 15ft double hander. Currently her backcast loops are pointy but have a bit of a saggy belly (this could be a description of me). I'd like to get to 'chisel' shaped loops with little or no sag. These are best achieved with a pull-back type stop that sees a characteristic 'S' shape in the rod as it unloads

Things I've tried:
Demo's from me showing a relatively low power lift followed by a pull-back stop. Demo of this resulting in chisel-shaped loops.
Demo's of the loop shape that she gets with a pointy loop but a saggy rod-leg formed by making a 'soft' stop.
Snap Casts - Stacey can snap the whole head back into the wind with ease, obviously with a tight loop.
A tea towel taped to the top of an umbrella - the idea is to make the towel 'snap' using the umbrella as the handle.
Me yelling 'stop the f*****g rod like you mean it' at her.

So over to you guys - what do you suggest?

Thanks, James

[Paul Arden]

Hi James,

If this was the single handed and not the dildo I would try talking about power application/snap rather than stop. With the single handed rod that’s easy, use the sequential stopping sequence with the final force coming from the wrist rotation, until it’s suddenly “blocked” at maximum wrist extension. I have no idea how you do that with the dildo but I imagine it might be bottom hand. I look forward to learning how it works with the long rod!

Good luck!

Cheers, Paul

[VGB]

I’ve no experience of DH casting which in my opinion makes me perfectly placed to offer an opinion Given that Stacey can perform a snap from the ground,the problem doesn’t appear to be either a physical or mental block. Without seeing her cast, is she by any chance leaning back on the cast and trying to use her trunk muscles to snap instead of pulling the lower hand back? Can she also make the desired cast with a SH rod?

Regards

Vince

[Lasse Karlsson]

Have you tried getting her to switch hands?
Late butt rotation?

If they are tight but sag, line velocity isn't high enough, draggin a bit before rotation can do wonders here.
And then use body to block the rod...

Maybe see a qualified two handed instructor

Cheers
Lasse

[jarmo]

Snap Casts - Stacey can snap the whole head back into the wind with ease, obviously with a tight loop.

If possible, I like to start with what the student can do, and make the student see the end result. With these in mind, I came up with the following idea. Notice: I have not tried this. Still, how about starting with the snap and working towards an (overhead) backcast?

1. Ensure the snap is a snap-t. Make the student face the dangle during the snap. Do snaps only, that is, backcasts only.
2. Ask her to reduce the amount of snap-down, but still try to aerialize the line. Do this on the side, so the the student can see the end result.
3. Gradually keep reducing snap while aerializing the line. At the same time, start lifting the casting plane towards vertical.

In addition to this idea, what Lasse said: dominant hand down, late rotation.

[easterncaster]

James,

I am going to steal your Snap idea - wow - fabulous!

Re Tracy:
- Snap higher, Stop too high (steep, stab the moon).
- Stop with stiff arms, anchored arms, squeeze to break the cork.
- Employ video !

Happy New Year,
Craig

[John Waters]

Hi James,

Buy one of those non stretch belts with adjustable plastic clips that clip together but allow the belt length to be adjusted by pulling the belt ends through where they insert into each side of the buckle. Place it around the waist and around the butt of the rod, use the bottom hand to hold it on position and use a couple of clothes pegs to clip it to the top of the slacks to stop it sliding down over the hips. Adjust the belt length to block the bottom hand on the back cast, at the desired rod angle for the back cast block. You can use the same option to train the top hand too. It is a training aid but it triggers the feel through the rod of a firm block. Use it for say, two or three casts only then remove it for the next two or three casts so that feel of the block through both the top hand and the rod is frequently assessed and reinforced.

John

[Paul Arden]

Well, I’m happy to go out on a limb on this, but I don’t think it’s a stopping problem; I think it’s a power application issue and should be dealt that way. Something has to happen before the stop!

Anyway, even if it’s not, another focus point is always useful.

[John Waters]

You're correct Paul, the loop shape is a result of the force applied, how quickly it is applied and how it is blocked.

John