Loop Morph

[Stefano De Martini]

I completely agree with Paul. The 170 allows you to reach a high line speed much more effectively. It is no coincidence that it is the method adopted practically everywhere. Certainly, as Michal says, attention must also be paid to delivery and I find the "whip" factor very important. This small but very important final movement is the one that sharpens the loop and gains distance.
This is my short video of a practice session, perfecting 170 with the MED.

[Paul Arden]

The delivery is an interesting topic. With the softer rods that I was using at the beginning I would BB/170 the delivery. I have seen some BFCC photos of me where the rod tip is almost hitting the ground on the forward cast. Those were from the days when I set the 130' records. Nowadays with the stiffer rods my arc is smaller. It may be, that because we are shooting line, there is less tension in the loop and consequently morphing is not so extreme.

I really need to film the delivery loop. To be honest I didn't expect to see such loop deflection on the backcast with my video as I did. I don't see that from where I stand.

Cheers, Paul

[Lasse Karlsson]

I really need to film the delivery loop. To be honest I didn't expect to see such loop deflection on the backcast with my video as I did. I don't see that from where I stand.

Cheers, Paul

We almost never see the interesting stuff from our position, and you need fast eyes, high speed camera is much much better

Looking forward to the clips, hoping the craftsmeb will soon be finished here in front of the blue building, only been blocked for two years now

Cheers
Lasse

[Paul Arden]

Jesus. Sounds like workers around here!

[John Waters]

That is correct Paul, I am far from competitive in the light line distances. I failed to get casts away in Cumbria and was metres behind the best. I believe I did have more than 60 feet in the air in Cumbria but I could be very mistaken in that as well. I am enjoying the training in the light line events anyway and have a long way to go but any improvement is a big filler for me. I still do not fully understand the background to the statements that the 170 delivers more speed to the loop than the 11 to 1 but will continue to try and better understand it. Your point about the loop width and collisions is interesting, I have not found that when I carry 85 plus feet but that may also reflect the possibility I am not generating enough speed to collide. It is going to be very difficult to get comparable measurements of speed of each backcast because so few use the latter technique. Steve has dominated the 5 weight results in all but Cumbria, when his results were well down on previous WCs. Maybe you are correct and that his result reflected his technique and the conditions. I am still struggling with the assertion that to carry 90 feet you must throw a wider loop because morphing will tighten it and a collision may result, and hence view this discussion really positively. I’ll get that understanding, just takes me a little longer than most blokes. At the end of the day nobody can question the total of the tape and what I read of the Cumbrian results and the examples you have proffered, the 170 is delivering the results.

Always learning,

John

[Paul Arden]

I think you are mistaken, John. Steve has never dominated in the worlds in the 5WT. Prior to Cumbria he’s been in one final. He missed Estonia. The final he did make he outcast me head to head in the eliminators. So there is that

Where he dominates is accuracy and he’s also pretty nifty at sea trout distance! The biggest casters for my money in 5WT - who are currently active - are Dmitri, Mikael and. Bernt. I would say Bart is up there now.

Line speed is greater because tip speed is greater because you are powering through the point when the rod tip deviates from the line path.

Cheers. Paul

[Lasse Karlsson]

Not buying the collision from morphing either

Cheers
Lasse

[John Waters]

Sorry Paul my error with Steve, you are right. I also had a look at the Cumbrian results. I’ve never examined them before but some here are the results of the blokes using the 11 to 1 technique.

S Rajeff 38.5m and 40.5m
G McCormack 38.5m and 39m
C Korich 35.5m and 38m
J Waters 37.5m and 38m

I think that is a reasonable selection of 11 to 1 technique in very strong winds. The 170 casters delivered far better results last year. As I said, can’t argue against the tape. As to my money, I reckon I’d follow your bet at this time.

John

[Paul Arden]

Steve doesn’t cast 11-1. His delivery casting arc is not dissimilar to everyone else’s. Where he does differ from most is that he blocks on his backcast.

I see the head length of the MED being borderline. It can be blocked in calm or light wind conditions. If the head length was unrestricted you would find a totally different set of results.

Cheers, Paul

[John Waters]

Sorry to be obtuse Gents but I am interested in understanding the “why” about 170 and backcast line speed. I understand Lasse’s comment about the musculature but when does the loop in the 170? Does the line overtake the rod tip when the rod moves past the vertical, or when the rod is much closure to the horizontal?

Thanks in advance,

John