Floating fly line colour.

[whinging pom]

There was a question at weekend that suddenly made me think why do I assume ‘ natural’ looking lines have a stalking advantage.
Floating fly lines: does colour matter? Is going for a dull olive/ brown of any advantage for river Trout or would a high viz orange make be just the same under the surface yet more visual to the angler ?
Thoughts please
Pom

[Lasse Karlsson]

I fish better when I can see the line. Fish shouldn't see it anyway, and they see it in contrast backlit, and then colour rarely matter.
So yeah, I don't mind fishing orange lines at all...

Sunlight and monofilament, that's something rarely talked about, it's like a lightsaber

Cheers
Lasse

[Paul Arden]

Hi Pom,

I think there are a few considerations. One is that if you float any coloured line over a spooky fish it will spook. (Tested in NZ!). I’d rather have a line I can see for accuracy. I don’t like fishing with orange lines, not because I think they spook more fish, because I don’t think they do, but because they don’t appeal to my sense of harmony

Often fly line colours are brought up as a consideration when spooking fish while casting. My go-to lines here are white lines, or just off white – SA Bonefish. Some might argue that these are stealthier in the air. But I can tell you for a fact that in the air they will spook both Snakehead and Gourami if delivered too close.

Glossy or colourful rods, now those spook fish!

Cheers, Paul

[whinging pom]

I fish better when I can see the line. Fish shouldn't see it anyway, and they see it in contrast backlit, and then colour rarely matter.
So yeah, I don't mind fishing orange lines at all...

Sunlight and monofilament, that's something rarely talked about, it's like a lightsaber

Cheers
Lasse

I’ve done decades of considering the window, keeping my profile low, considering the sun position and the shadow of the line in the position of the fish. Everything I could the avoid lining the fish.
But it seems somewhere back in the mist of time some advertising or an article stuck it in my head that it was best for dryfly fishing to have a natural colour line , or even a Heron Grey one being optimal.
I feel daft for just accepting it unquestioning but that’s what many of us do when we’re learning and “the die is cast” and we continue along accepting this myth as proven fishing experience and wisdom.

Even in a tree lined stretch and allowing for refraction, if the lines seen by the trout through window it can only be a silhouette right??! Even allowing for ‘Umwelt’ and the the physically different receptors in the eye, from the fishes position whether it’s white, orange, or dark green it’s hard to think of an exceptional circumstance that the colour of the line would be registered.
I’ve got a dark green line that re-assuring all but disappears from my view on the surface. I’m realising this is more of a hindrance to me than a help.
Seems you guys feel the same , I wondered if anyone was going to contradict this.

The light sabre flash of mono I can quite get and understand, though wonder if it’s from the shining reflective surface , or the translucent material ( could the effect be dulled by mild abrasive fullers earth or rotten stone in the sinkant paste.

Stuart Crofts explained to me an experiment he did with Tippet of varying thickness up to quite unrealistic like 20lb mono, showing attached to the fly they made don’t difference to acceptance by the trout.., visually , it was the effect of the micro drag they created that put the fish off.

It was another myth busting moment for me. Which means I’ll now choose limpness of material over finest diameter.

I’m wondering if Stephen Parkes asking me what I’d like from a fishing line for light wieght small stream line is the start of another myth busted?!
WP

[Paul Arden]

Wet fly line flash is certainly an issue. I think it was Goddard and Clarke who photographed flylines in the air from underwater?

When I’m chasing Gourami on the top I’ve seen them spook while the cast is in the air and flying towards them. I’ve seen Snakehead spook with the fly flying towards them.

Next time I have a friend visiting I’ll shoot some video. I do have a blue fly line in the post. Maybe…

Cheers, Paul

[Lasse Karlsson]

The light sabre flash of mono I can quite get and understand, though wonder if it’s from the shining reflective surface , or the translucent material ( could the effect be dulled by mild abrasive fullers earth or rotten stone in the sinkant paste.

Stuart Crofts explained to me an experiment he did with Tippet of varying thickness up to quite unrealistic like 20lb mono, showing attached to the fly they made don’t difference to acceptance by the trout.., visually , it was the effect of the micro drag they created that put the fish off.

Back in the dark ages of me being young, I spinfished quite alot, this is before superlines, gelspun etc. And one fine summer day, I wanted to see how the lurer we used was looking under water, and not just being dragged from side to side in front of us. So on with the Google and fins, and out in the water, swimming along side the lures to check the movements as my fishing buddy cast and retrieved from the shore, one thing that really stood out, was that the monofilament line was like a fluorecent industrial light attached to the lure. I guess its the light being bounced back on the inside of the cylinder of mono. In overcast its much less though. And don't tell anyobe that it also happens with flouorocarbon

Simon Gawesworth once tried how short a leader he could get away with, one day when the fish was on. It ended up with about an inch of leader after the flyline

Love when myths crumble!

Cheers
Lasse

[Paul Arden]

You can knock off the shine with Fullers Earth mix of course. I muddy up my leaders even with HiD lines. Carry mud with me to Saltwater too. Clear flylines are the worst by the way. Not sure why anyone thinks these are stealthy! Sure we can’t seem them when we cast them but they shine up in sunlight and you can see this clearly on the hang.

Cheers, Paul

[Paul Arden]

Incidentally it might be of interest that I experimented with different colour braid for tippets and Gourami fishing. I did notice a difference in refusals. I tried yellow (why not!), light and dark green, sky blue and black. Black was best, dark green next. I never caught a fish on blue or yellow. I’m sure I probably could but after a couple of refusals (with the fish swimming up the braid) I swapped over.

I can’t remember who it was now, but someone told me that to catch birds they use nets that are black. It might have been Ivitca. I’ve never even heard of a black floating line.

Cheers, Paul

[whinging pom]

Omg I just lost all the answer I typed!!!

I remember the Goddard and Clark book looking at flies from below showing the refraction around the fly where it sat in the meniscus and trying to predict the chromatic aberration. Shot on film through a camera. I wonder how much this actually represented the trouts view, with its different colour spectrum and dominant colours than ours . The different mechanics in the eye to light level change ( a static sized iris) and how that may change colour perception. And different lens construction at the front. And the monocular/ binocular vision areas and what that actually restricts.

Or infact what actually triggered the response to avoid or accept , movement , colour , shape? .
And what makes them flight?

Movement above is the obvious and most attacks come from up there. But what about the tens of thousands of silver horns passing a few centimetres above the surface, or the agile darter dragon flies, or big Mayflies suddenly appearing in the window.
Is a distant fly line going to be anymore obtrusive or shocking? Or do they also bolt from the insects ?

On the question of blue , in England many of the Sea trout flies for night fishing are blue. Whether that was too do with years of collective experience and trout having a more dominant reception of blue in low light, or whether Hugh Faulkus wrote that it was best and bleating we all followed along the path .

Stuart Crofts experiment involved attaching short lengths of tippet from very fine to very thick to flies , from the vantage of a bridge he dropped them to a feeding trout and none of them were rejected . He then tied some fine tippet on a spool and dropped it into the food lane and drifted it over the trout.. it was rejected. No mater what angle he tried he couldn’t kill the drag.
He’s convinced that tippet diameter is not the issue it’s drag.
I follow the same path , my tippets chosen for its limpness .

I’ve heard someone fishing with him say they saw him using the remaining foot of tippet rather than waste an evening rise redoing the front end.

I did years ago use brown maxima whichI tried on a whim, but stuck with it until it became to hard to find, Icant say it was remarkably different, but I did feel more confident using it.
And confidence is what most of this is about, and why I’ve always gone for natural coloured fly lines , unquestioning the reasoning.

Paul surely in the tropics yours are even more silhouetted by back light.

I carry mud from the banks of Matuara near the Nokomai gorge, it’s like fullers earth, it’s not so much to sink it, but kill the shine.

Interesting about the coloured braids is that sunken or on the surface ?


Wp

[VGB]

I’ve seen grayling spook at a white #2 fly line in the air and also at red leader going by. I agree with Pom about tippet diameter and drag. Pete T has a dit about casting to rising trout with gradually increasing breaking strain, I think they were still getting takes at 12lb which was either the thickest they had or they ran out.

Or infact what actually triggered the response to avoid or accept , movement , colour , shape?

Paul Gaskell goes into detail on this topic in his latest book Nature of Fly Fishing that I was fortunate to pick up on an introductory offer. It’s worth a read if you’re geeky about fish behaviour.

Regards

Vince