Under estimating translational movement

[VGB]

We are fishing in different parts of the pond. You are teaching people to move precisely, I'm usually introducing people to the idea that it is possible to vary these parameters. Both of our students are going through the 3 step learning process though: what do I have to do, I think I can do it but don't interrupt me, and look Dad no hands.

One eye closed, just working the other one

[VGB]

I don't talk about arc until much later because you have to define where the true centre of rotation is at any instant in time

[Paul Arden]

Hi Vince,

I fish in all parts of the pond and adjust accordingly! What isn’t well explained, is which part of the pond we are fishing in at the time – and we/I really should get better at doing this.

For the shallows, I think instead of varying tip path trajectory, the same adjustments can be made by talking about targets. I introduce an imaginary and nicely sounding “Backcast Bell”, that needs to be rung very early on.

The closer the front target, the higher the bell behind us. The further away, the lower the bell but usually still above the horizontal when aligned to the rod tip. And every once in a while the bell is positioned lower than the rod tip… eg for pile casts and sock exploding distance casts.

This is something I teach to all levels: from first lesson with beginners, all the way through to shot-taking with advanced Imaginary Saltwater students.

The adjustments happen. And we — or at least you, I and some of us — want student exploration to occur.

I can also eliminate Creep, with the focus of the caster remaining on the fly actually striking the bell. “Ting!” Thats the sound it makes when casting an imaginary Goldhead!

Anyway, I think there is an important distinction in there, it’s more aligned to what we do and the adjustments happen naturally, with the added benefit of using more-distant external cues.

Cheers, Paul

[VGB]

Hi Paul

I understand your point and I can see how a consistent cue can help over time. I’ve found that most of the stillwater students arrive tailing and if I tell them to hit a bell, it will get f’ing clattered. Maybe they need a triangle instead of a bell, like they have in an orchestra

Regards

Vince

[Paul Arden]

I never had that as the usual cast with Stillwater students. But flylines actually conformed to AFTM/now AFFTA back then. I think heavier lines would exaggerate their mistakes.

An interesting problem without a long-lasting quick fix!!

Cheers, Paul

[VGB]

Usually square on to the water, up/down elbow cast and worried about hitting something behind them, I usually see a wide open back cast followed by a forward punch as they try to “feel” the mass of the line.

Regards

Vince

[Phil Blackmar]

Sorry, this is a little out of order as the thread has drifted to teaching. Going back to the SLP conversation-If a straight fly leg is the objective, the tip has to move in a straight line for a certain portion of the stroke. I have no idea what that ratio may be or if it may change with length of cast. Isn't creating a straight fly leg a dynamic endeavor where there is no one control knob, but rather, a sequence of influences at the disposal of the caster. Add some of this, do a little of that, do this now not then.......isn't that like a color palette used by artists for fly fishermen and women?

hand path
rotation
translation
acceleration
rapid acceleration
timing of rotation or rapid acceleration

[Paul Arden]

I’ll add to that line configuration at the beginning of the stroke. Everything else can be lumped under tip path. Jumping around a bit here. Nils has asked to separate into topics which I think is a good idea.

But I’m celebrating New Year with the wife, and so will be back tomorrow!!

Cheers, Paul

[Paul Arden]

Yep it’s a stroke rebuild for me, Vince. Surprised you are getting up/down elbow. I used to get a straight hand punch. In either case it’s about building a variable stroke and not a fixed one, which we often see. Thank God I don’t deal with this in one lesson nowadays!!

Have a good one!

Cheers, Paul

[VGB]

Hi Paul

I just go straight for old way, new way now. Have a great New Year

I have no idea what that ratio may be or if it may change with length of cast. Isn't creating a straight fly leg a dynamic endeavor where there is no one control knob, but rather, a sequence of influences at the disposal of the caster. Add some of this, do a little of that, do this now not then.......isn't that like a color palette used by artists for fly fishermen and women?

hand path
rotation
translation
acceleration
rapid acceleration
timing of rotation or rapid acceleration

Knotty little problem, isn’t it

Regards

Vince