Casting injuries

[Bernd Ziesche]

Don't "worry" Vince. I was told, the best way to avoid such injuries is to stay out of such extremes. And it seems Sweden (or probably better to say the ICSF) just made this quite easy for some TD junkies. 🫣

[John Waters]

Have you picked up anything other than the torso twist that you are willing to share?

Vince

A few Vince.

John

[Paul Arden]

I think it opens up a lot of questions. To be honest I haven’t heard of many injuries caused by flycasting although plenty that are aggregated by it. This oval casting is interesting but also I think in US the proportion of casters casting ovally is higher. The hand pronation is also interesting and as I’ve written earlier I believe this possibly comes from the sports played in the USA.

Having said that I’m sure poor technique is going to cause injuries. Coming around the shoulder as opposed to through it, I can certainly feel in the shoulder. The use of very stiff rods can certainly cause tennis elbow. My belief there is that one cause is trying to “stop” so much of the lever in the first instance; with a bend rod we progressively “stop” it. Casting very stiff rods is “jarring”. And we know of many cases of TE in casting sport.

But I think there is another thing here to be considered. Injury prevention is not just about good technique but also about regularly exercising. Regular exercise and longevity are inextricably linked. If we are engaged in a throwing sport (and even if not) it makes sense to try to stay strong and flexible. The older we get the more this matters.

For those interested, I really enjoy Peter Attia’s “The Drive” podcasts that Andy linked to last year. I’ve been listening to many of these and sometimes fall asleep to them – which is particularly ironic when listening to a podcast on Sleep. I know Carol is a big listener too.

Back to topic. How do you deal with it when someone comes to a lesson and tells you that they have an injury?

Cheers, Paul

[Rickard]

Back to topic. How do you deal with it when someone comes to a lesson and tells you that they have an injury?

I would say that you start with investigating if it is an actual injury or pain.

I think that pain, discomfort and low grade inflammation is best fixed by correcting the movement pattern.

If it is an actual injury I think we shouldn't stop doing things. But stop doing things that aggravate the injury. We can change load, speed and movement pattern. I think that movement helps the healing.

[Paul Arden]

That’s good advice Richard.

The problem can be that the movement pattern I would like to create sometimes actually causes the pain. This can be from some younger sports injury or surgery etc. Of course I change what I’m doing

Cheers, Paul

[Rickard]

That’s good advice Richard.

The problem can be that the movement pattern I would like to create sometimes actually causes the pain. This can be from some younger sports injury or surgery etc. Of course I change what I’m doing

Cheers, Paul

That one is harder. But we still have load and speed to work with. If the movement can be done without pain with lower speed and load start to build from there. We can lower the load by changing variables of the rod. We can increase load at low speed by working on the pattern in the gym.

[Paul Arden]

I think there are two parts 1) can the long term injury be improved say by strength training and/or stretching? Which is clean out of my territory and they need to see a physio.

2) can we develop a different pattern to produce similar results?

I’ll give you an example. I’ve had students who experience pain by lifting the elbow vertically above a certain point. Now I definitely don’t want to aggravate it. So I work developing a different pattern with them.

I always find it interesting that advice from physios always comes with a professional disclaimer. Something like: “this is just advice and may in fact be wrong for you, so go and see another physio for a proper consultation!”

Cheers, Paul

[Bernd Ziesche]

Hello Rickard,
Well put!

I remember I had a left handed studend in a 2 day Sea trout workshop long ago. On the second day breakfast I realized him to be left handed. It turned out he tried to learn fly casting (total beginner) right handed all first day long, because everyone else did, too. So his conclusion was, that fly casting is done right handed (as he explained to me).
Same with injuries, some students tell you, many don't. I even had a client booking a hosted trip for Sea trout fishing with me, while not telling me, that he was in his very last days based on lung cancer. We made it a good time, but he died a few days after.
Over the years I learnt my lessons what to check for straight away.
Anyway even without pre injuries one student may struggle to adapt to what matches perfectly to the other student. In a face to face lesson I realize this immediately today. On one hand there are typical moves where I need to take care, some I stay out, and then I add enough brakes and look to keep false casting cycles short. On the other hand I read the client's faces and movements as well as keeping an eye on flexibility ranges.
For videocall based teaching this needs to be taken care of a bit differently though. Takes a bit more time for me.
I yet have too little experience here, but I think coming forward seems harder via smartphone compared to reality.
Regards
B

[Rickard]

I always find it interesting that advice from physios always comes with a professional disclaimer. Something like: “this is just advice and may in fact be wrong for you, so go and see another physio for a proper consultation!”

Cheers, Paul

I think that is because the physio is only guessing what to do.
A large part of a physios work is to be a mental support. To help the patient dare to get moving again by finding portions of movement that doesn't hurt or hurt at a manageable level. Since pain is something very complex. It isn't just something physical. After the physical trauma has healed there are a lot of mental things behind pain also.

[Paul Arden]

I’m pretty sure it’s so they don’t get sued, or in case they do. And I’ve taken note of that.