Hauling - pulling fly line through the guides

[Lou Bruno]

I just finished reading the first page on the "Dissecting the haul" post. I had a question after reading the first page, I thought it best to start a new post instead of tacking on my question to the last page.

Several times when describing the definition of a haul the phrase, ”hauling the line through the guides increases line speed" is used.

By that definition, is it possible to haul and NOT have the line travel through the guides; basically the rod motion would have to travel faster than the haul line speed?

Not sure if this comes up in other post...but I'm curious to hear some thoughts on this.
I was out practicing haul timing yesterday, are there images available that show loop profiles generated based on our haul timing?

My apologies if my answers are buried in the rest of the post!

Lou

[Paul Arden]

Hi Lou,

By that definition, is it possible to haul and NOT have the line travel through the guides; basically the rod motion would have to travel faster than the haul line speed?

By that definition it wouldn’t be a haul! However it’s certainly possible to make a hauling movement and not pull line through the guides. One of the major improvements in someone’s cast, can be to rotate the torso at the beginning of the forward cast, which positions the rod in front of the hauling hand, consequently in which case when the haul movement is initiated it pulls line through the rings.

Cheers, Paul

[Lou Bruno]

Paul

I thought that prior to adding this post topic.

Now I need to ask is there any situation where our rod movement speed coincides with our hauling line speed that prevents the line from being pulled into the guides? Whether by accident or by design.

Let's say for instance I haul late, at RSP and my hauling length is short; preventing the line from being pulled into the guides...that possible?

We can haul without rod motion or very limited rod motion. The haul is independent of rod motion.

Lou

[Lou Bruno]

Paul

To clarify, we can haul after loop formation...after our stop.
If our hauling length is short, line does not get pulled into the guides. That's not a haul. Or, I haul and my rod option is in the opposite direction of the haul; or the rod is moved in a direction that limits the line from being pulled into the guides.

Those situations are not hauls. If we use " pull back" to prevent the hauling line from going into the guides...if possible, it's not a haul.

I'm stuck on the fact that our line needs to be pulled long enough to make sure it gets pulled into the guides.

Lou

[Lou Bruno]

*edit option.. should be motion.

[Paul Arden]

Hi Lou,

I think I talked about this with the Nick videos. Can’t remember which one however.

This is unlikely to haul the line because the line and rod hand are not moving apart (probably).

However simply by turning the torso we can position our rod hand in front of the line hand so that we will have a separation of the hands which will haul the line.

I’m not sure this answers your question however?

Cheers, Paul

[Bernd Ziesche]

Hello Lou,
Following those vids on vimeo, you find a description explaining what hauling is to me.

It's all about pulling the line tgru the guides.
Regards
Bernd

[Graeme H]

Hi Lou,

Maybe this is not what you’re asking about, but I often need to get a student to change the direction of their haul. They may think they are hauling, but unless the haul hand path is somewhat aligned with the butt axis, their haul is ineffective.

In other words, these students are moving their hands away from the butt axis rather than along it. Their hand is moving, but the line is not moving through the rod guides.

Cheers, Graeme

[Lou Bruno]

Graeme

Thank you; doesn't Paul teach hauling away from the butt axis during the back cast? I'm I understanding you correctly.
Lou

[Paul Arden]

I’m not sure what the butt axis is? Is that the rod plane?

Anyway for distance I teach to work out what your fastest haul pattern is, and then to fit the rest of the stroke around that. I do teach that we should haul away from the rod to a hauling arm angle 180 degrees away from back and front targets. “Finishing like the wings of an aeroplane” (at least with the 170).

Most common weakness I see is the forward cast haul. I see two problems, one is hauling using an almost straight arm. This is because the caster is trying to connect his hands at the beginning of the stroke. Hauling with a relatively straight hauling arm is slower than accelerating from a bent elbow.

The other common issue is beginning the haul with the rod behind the hauling hand. This is fixed by rotating the torso first to bring the rod hand in front of the hauling hand. Working on a Launch sequence with the line starting on the ground is a good drill for this.

Other issues are not hauling to a fully straightened hauling arm finishing position on distance. Not hauling past the body on the forward haul. And bouncing the haul instead of a slight pause at the end of the haul.

Cheers, Paul